Episode 188 - Welcome John from Minus33, Winter Bonds Hike, Trail Adoption Update, Mysterious Corbin Park

[00:00:08] Here is the latest Higher Summits forecast brought to you by our friends at the Mount Washington Observatory. Weather above treeline in the White Mountains is often wildly different than at our trailheads. Before you hike, check the Higher Summits forecast at mountwashington.org.

[00:00:30] Weather observers working at the non-profit Mount Washington Observatory write this elevation-based forecast every morning and afternoon. Search and Rescue teams, avalanche experts, and backcountry guides all rely on the Higher Summits forecast to anticipate weather conditions above treeline. You should too.

[00:00:52] Go to mountwashington.org or text FORECAST to 603-356-2137. And here is your forecast for the weekend of March 9th, 2025.

[00:01:21] So we have a windchill advisory in effect from 4am Eastern Standard Time Friday through 7pm Saturday to begin with. It's going to be a little bit chilly out there. Friday mostly in the clouds with a chance of snow showers, possible snow accumulations of 1-3 inches with a high around 0 degrees.

[00:01:46] Winds will be northwest at 50-65 mph early, rapidly increasing to 85-105 mph with gusts up to 145 mph with the windchill falling to 30 below to 40 below. Yeah, it's pretty chilly. Friday night? Pardon me.

[00:02:07] In the clouds with a chance of snow showers, possible snow accumulations of a trace to 2 inches with a low around 5 below. Winds will be northwest at 80-100 mph with gusts up to 140 mph, decreasing to 65-85 mph with gusts up to 110. The windchill will be falling to 40 below to 50 below. Wow.

[00:02:34] All right, and Saturday in the clouds with a chance of snow showers, possible snow accumulations of a trace to 2 inches with a high around 0 degrees. Winds will be northwest at 65-85 mph with gusts up to 110 mph with the windchill rising to 30 below to 40 below.

[00:02:57] Hacker's studio in the great state of New Hampshire.

[00:03:36] Welcome to the sounds like a search and rescue podcast, where we discuss all things related to hiking and search and rescue in the White Mountains of New Hampshire. Here are your hosts, Mike and Stump.

[00:03:49] In 88, we're getting a little long in the tooth here. Getting close to the big 200.

[00:04:22] I remember recording the first episode and listening, and then we both agreed. We were like, we've got to re-record. This doesn't sound good. I know. That was a long time ago. Five years. Yeah. I don't know if we've gotten better or if we've just stopped caring as much. That's too funny. Well, people like it, so whatever. I don't know. Yeah, generally. I mean, I don't ask for feedback, but I've heard generally good things.

[00:04:50] But, Stomp, can you give an update on the snowmobile situation? Are you going to get back to hiking soon, do you think? Oh, I would think so. Usually, historically, snowmobiling doesn't last past the New Hampshire February vacation. It's a miracle if they get into March. So we're on borrowed time. The two inches of rain probably killed a lot of the trails, sort of in the central band of the whites. But they're getting four inches.

[00:05:19] The only question is, is that going to be enough to restore the base of six inches that they need to open the trail? So I'm waiting. But if it happens at all, it'll just be like the last two days, I'm sure, over the weekend. And then I'll be a hiking fanatic again. Do you—will you just—I mean, I don't know. You probably have snuck up Weld Sticky once or twice. But will you just go to Weld Sticky to start off with?

[00:05:45] Because you had mentioned wanting to go to Cardigan, but I'm assuming that that's a little—it's a little early to hit the whole trail or anything. I don't—well, yeah. Under these conditions, I wouldn't do it. But a month ago, with all that thick snow, I think it would have been fine without—yeah, yeah. Because that's the shape it was in when I did it the first time. It was like late winter. And all those steep slabs were pretty much boot holes that you could just walk right up those steep slabs. So it took away the fear of those sections.

[00:06:14] So—but right now, it's going to be clear ice after the next freeze that's coming in. But, yeah, I don't know. I was thinking about doing a deratissima, like a— Well, you're going to slow your roll. You know who—I'm trying to remember—oh, our friend Paul Gamal. He was talking about wanting to connect with you, and I've been wanting to do this too, the Grand Traverse. So it's on my bucket list for this year. Oh, 100%. Yeah, let me know. Yeah, we need to do that. Yeah. We need to do that for sure.

[00:06:44] Anytime. Awesome. So, all right, Stomp. So welcome to episode 188 of the Sounds Like a Search and Rescue podcast. This week, we are joined by John Glidden of Minus 33. So Minus 33 is a clothing company. We've talked about them often on the show. So they believe that no one should feel uncomfortable or ill-prepared in the outdoor community, and having reliable gear is one of the first steps towards a lifetime of passion for whatever your activity is.

[00:07:12] So John's going to join us to talk about the history and mission of Minus 33 and their fine Merino wool products. He's going to give us some tips and advice on some of their products that can help hikers stay warm and comfortable. So looking forward to that. Plus, we've got a recap of a recent winter hiking attempt for me stomp on the Bonds, but a successful hike for my friends. So we'll get into that. Okay. I had to turn back a little early.

[00:07:42] I'm a little shame here, but we got it done. Plus some reminders. We got the AMC 4,000 Footer Club Award ceremonies coming up. I got some information on trail adoption stomp. So I pulled the trigger, and I'm actually going forward to adopt trail this year. So we'll talk a little bit about that. We had a listener send in some details about the New Hampshire County high points, which reminded us about the mysterious Corbin Park. So we'll talk about that stomp.

[00:08:12] I feel like you've talked about it once or twice on the show before, but we'll talk about that in more detail. And then we've got a segment for advice for AT thru-hikers to prepare them for their trek across New Hampshire. So we'll break down all the Appalachian Trail sections of New Hampshire, including shelters, trail towns, hostel options, and then tips and advice. So I'm Mike. And I'm stomp. Let's get started.

[00:08:52] Excellent. So stomp, let's give a moment for our friend Christina at Wild Raven Endurance Coaching. Hi, I'm Christina from Wild Raven Endurance Coaching. I work with athletes of all levels, from hikers to triathletes, helping you reach your goals with personalized guidance. With years of experience hiking, mountain biking, and trail running across New England, I also have a deep knowledge of the New Hampshire 4,000 footers and the surrounding trails.

[00:09:22] Whether you're a beginner hiker or a seasoned athlete, I'll guide you towards your goals, reducing injury risk and improving your performance through social and social. Smart, tailored coaching. Are you looking to transition from hiking to mountain running? I'm here to make that journey easier too. My approach combines strength training, mindfulness, and life balance on and off the trail. Let me help you find more joy in your sport while getting stronger and healthier along the way.

[00:09:49] Visit www.coaching.christinafulsick.com and start your adventure today. Okay, so listeners, if you want to start your wellness journey and improve your conditioning or get in shape, feel free to reach out to Christina. She will whip you into shape.

[00:10:18] Yeah, and it's time to prepare for the Ara Vapa season too. All the trail running races are coming up real quick. They are, they are. You know what else is coming up, Snob, quick? What's that? Our new series of podcasts. So we're going to do a little bit different concept, which we're calling it So You Wanna. Uh-huh.

[00:10:41] Becker Studio in the great state of New Hampshire.

[00:11:13] Welcome to the Sounds Like a Search and Rescue Podcast. So You Wanna. A video series where we share post-hike reflections, challenges, lessons learned, and essential insights to prepare you for your next adventure. Let's get started.

[00:11:47] The idea is So You Wanna Hike. So we've got a couple of episodes that are already recorded. I've got to do some editing. We're going to do some video stuff this time around, so it's taking a little bit more time. But we should start rolling those out in the next, what do you think, week and a half, two weeks? I would think so. Yeah. Yep. Yeah, it's cool. So we've got a couple of 52 of the views in the can right now. Manad knocking well sticky, and then we will be knocking a few more out.

[00:12:15] So these will be shorter form, you know, anywhere from 10 to 30 minutes. I think we did one longer one just because it's a special surprise one. Yeah. We'll just be dropping those. I don't know. There'll be no rhyme or reason or schedule on those ones, but we'll keep to our regular weekly show. And then we're going to work on, we're going to reach out to some contacts we have about the 200 episodes. So stay tuned for that too. Awesome. Yeah. Excited. Yep. Very excited. So Stomp, you pulled an article here.

[00:12:45] So just going back to Christina and Wild Raven getting back in shape, you pulled this article that obesity rates worldwide are exploding. What is this all about? Yeah. It's a study by The Lancet and The Guardian expounded upon it. They're basically saying that more than half of adults worldwide will be overweight or obese by 2050. So it's a staggering number.

[00:13:10] So there are now 2.1 billion adults age 25 or above and 493 million children who are overweight or obese. And it's projected to continue upwardly. So this article really doesn't go into the causes and it really doesn't talk about strategies to reduce that really.

[00:13:36] But I thought it was nice to mention the fact that hiking is such a great intervention to start moving and start burning calories. And it's so gentle and it's a good solution in my opinion to start to counteract this. The numbers are terrifying and it's really a shame. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if they're putting something in the food that makes you want to eat it or whatnot. I mean, I just got done eating some Cheez-It stomp.

[00:14:04] But I am trying to go back to my sort of high-protein, low-carb diet. But yeah, it is a problem. People are getting fatter. I don't know. I mean, I think we just got to keep moving. Yeah, keep on moving. Get off the couch. No more binge TV. Hard to do. Hey, I want to be curious about your theory. I have this wacky theory. All right.

[00:14:31] Is the obesity epidemic the result of a highly successful smoking cessation campaign? So in other words, in the 60s, 70s, and 80s, are the people that are obese right now, would they have otherwise been the smokers in the 60s, 70s, and 80s, which would have kept people skinnier? Because I think smoking just keeps people skinnier because it's like- Yeah.

[00:14:59] So I wonder, because I do feel like the countries that have the most obesity are the ones that were more out front in stopping smoking. Where you get some countries in Europe where the smoking rates are still pretty high and those people tend to be skinnier. So it's like, what's the balance? It's like, maybe we should just start encouraging people to smoke cigarettes again. Yeah. Nicotine pouches. There you go. I don't know. I mean, it's certainly possible.

[00:15:25] There's certainly a connection there with increased metabolism and whatnot if you're smoking. But- Yeah. I mean, the- I don't think there's one answer. No, there isn't. I mean, the technological burden that we're all sitting here, sitting on our phones, not moving around as much. I mean, that's got to be part of it too. Processed foods, certainly. Yeah, it's multifactorial, I guess. Yeah, yeah.

[00:15:50] I don't think me and you are going to solve this, but I do think your original point stomp about getting out and hiking or just committing to moving for an hour a day, I think, is a good defense. It's not going to be perfect and it's not going to help everyone, but it's a pretty good defense. Yeah, there's a lot of research out there saying like three times a week, 40 minutes just walking does tremendous amounts of good. So, yeah. It's good to be aware of this. Yep. Stomp, I appreciate you listening.

[00:16:19] You're thinking for the listener. You're looking out for the listener's wellness and I appreciate that. That's right. That's right. Yeah, put myself out of a job. I don't want to have to work on these people with their sore joints and everything else. Oh, believe me. I don't think you'll ever get put out of a job no matter what we do. Um, and then, uh, stop. You have, uh, you have a little article here. We'll get back to the spring equinox in a second, but you have a little article here about how to improve hiking stamina.

[00:16:49] Yeah. So, uh, another great research point here. So swearing is linked with increased pain tolerance and strength. So, I think it's time to start cussing a lot more on your hiking trips if you want to really push those miles. Maybe that's what you should have done on the bonds. Start cussing and like, oh man, I don't know. Could, could do it. But, uh, swearing is a drug-free, calorie-neutral, cost-free means of self-help, says Richard Stevens,

[00:17:17] a researcher and senior lecturer in psychology at Keele University in England. Do you have a favorite swear word? Oh, I can't tell you. Yeah. We'll lose half the listenership. What's yours? Probably f***ing. Yeah. I mean, that's a classic. I use that quite a bit. Yeah. I mean, swearing is awesome. It really is. Oh boy. It's great.

[00:17:47] We're going to have to, uh, no, no. We're going to have to edit that out because minus 33 is coming on. So we didn't want to hear that. Oh, you know. Just what you can do is bleep it and then people can just, um. The bleep. Come up with their own, um, theory on it. So. Yeah. I'll have to find the spot, but yeah, just do a bleep on that one. So, yeah. I want to hear a lot more swearing reverberating in the ravines and the hills this summer. Okay. Yes. Yeah. That's a good one.

[00:18:14] Um, and then speaking of summer stomp, we are quickly approaching the spring equinox, which is on March 20th. So, um, the, the seasons are changing. I think mud season's coming up pretty soon. And so, um, any, any tips that you want to, you want to give the listeners or reminders? You always are. I think you're always on top of the mud season and the stick season for us. It seems like that's your expertise. Oh, the ones that come to mind quick are make sure you're able to hike in these areas. Certain areas do close for mud season.

[00:18:42] Uh, the squams in particular, um, I guess tonight makes note of that. Um, so make sure you're able to go to the location you want to go to, um, get minus 33 socks. Make sure you have the right footwear because mud season can be a mess. Another big issue post holing. So it's that weird in between time where you're going to be switching out between spikes and snowshoes. Um, so watch out for those post holios. You don't want to break an angle. Um, same thing with light lights and issue.

[00:19:13] It's, it's warmer during the day to colder at night, that odd transition. So just make sure you have all that cold winter stuff with you as it's getting warmer. Don't fall for that trap. Yeah. And other than that, I don't know. What do you think? Any? Those are, those are all good tips, Tom. Thanks. I remember something about hiking. Yeah, exactly.

[00:19:39] I think there's a tendency this time of the year or as the trails start clearing out to try to sort of bypass the mud and the nastiness or whatever. I think you just have to embrace the muck. Oh yeah. And just plow right through the trail and like get your feet wet. Get to have a nice pair of wool socks, like you said, and just, just get them wet. Yeah. And, and don't go off trail and mess things up. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good point to stay on trail. Don't create new trails if that's what you mean. Yep.

[00:20:09] Exactly. Excellent. All right, stop. So I have with me, I'm going to show you this. This is a visual, but what I'm showing Stomp right now is I'm opening a letter and the letter is from the Appalachian Mountain Club 4,000 footer committee. No, not the FBI. I have this fancy patch. Oh, wow. It's the winter version of the 4,000 footer patch. I get it. Right.

[00:20:40] There you go. Hold on. There you go. Wow. Nice work. Yeah. I actually got finally, I mean, I typically, I think I got rejected from about 25 colleges, but I did get accepted into the winter 4,000 footer club. So very excited. Congrats. So you finished them last winter, last year, right? Yes. And I didn't submit right away. I think I put, I think I sent mine in like sometime in maybe August or September and then, oh no, wait a minute.

[00:21:09] It was probably closer to November, December. So it took like two or three months for them to get back. Yeah. Which is fine, you know, and they have a lot to review and they probably do them in bulk. So I'm very excited. And then I just wanted to remind the listeners that the awards dinner is on Saturday, April 26th at the Exeter High School. All right. And the awards ceremony, what's that song? I'll put it in my book.

[00:21:40] Put it in your book. So from 4 to 630, there are informal gatherings and then exhibits. So we were there last year. There's a bunch of different, you know, we actually, US Sherpa was there. Bunch of great hiking and product companies and information companies are there. And then there's a, there's a dinner in the cafeteria.

[00:22:05] And then the presentation of the dog awards happens outside on the parking lot of the high school. And then from 630 to 830 is the award ceremony in the auditorium. So doggies are not allowed inside the building, so they have to stay outside. But otherwise you can come in at 630 to 830 for the ceremony. Yeah. That sounds great. Are we doing a table this year? I don't know. We got to reach out and see what they say. Yeah. The last I left it with them, I think we are, but you know, I can certainly man the

[00:22:33] table so you can go up and claim your glory. Okay. Sounds like a plan. I'll make sure nobody steals our stickers while you're up on stage. Right, right. Exactly. So, but yeah, but hopefully listeners are, are going to visit and it's a, it's a great time. There was a good crowd last year. I'm hoping it'll be a good crowd this year. Oh, it was a great time. Yep. Oh, Dave. Actually one more thing.

[00:23:00] I think Dave had an idea that we should do a table outside so we can do a slasher red carpet. That would be funny. Oh, that's a great idea. That wouldn't go over well. We could be like the E! News anchors interviewing people as they walk in. And here comes Floki. Yes. Excellent. That's fun. All right. So just, I guess just in, in the theme of the spring equinox that's coming.

[00:23:26] So we're going to have the, the time clock turned back on, on Sunday. I think there's a blood moon coming up. So you're, you seem to be the expert on the different types of moons. So can you explain what a blood moon, you know, the harvest moon and the blue moon and what is a blood moon? Yeah. Well, first of all, this is coming, what is it? March 13th and 14th. And unfortunately for us, it's, it's visible at like 2.30 in the morning. Um, so as, as you know, it's a lunar eclipse.

[00:23:55] So the earth moves between the sun and the moon blocking the sunlight. But in this particular, uh, circumstance, it creates a reddish hue this time of the year for whatever reason. Uh, I guess it's the earth's atmosphere scatters shorter wavelengths of sunlight, allowing longer wavelengths of red, orange light to bend into the earth's shadow, creating the blood moon. So that's pretty cool. Unfortunately, it's so damn early in the morning or late at night, however you want to look at it.

[00:24:24] But you know, when these things happen, it's always great to find a location to try to, try to see it. I mean, this is, it's cool. Right. Right. Yeah. You know, it's easy to say, like if I were you, I'd be like, oh, I'm just going to, you know, wake up and go hike up well sticky and see it from there. Obviously it depends on the cloud cover, but like then the reality of waking up when you're from your nice warm bed is like, I don't think so. Next year. Exactly.

[00:24:51] So anyway, so, but if you, if you are, if you do feel motivated and it is a clear night, it would be a good night to try to hike across like Franconia Ridge or something. Wow. Can you imagine? That'd be awesome. That would be fun. Slasher's hiking topic of the week.

[00:25:11] So Stomp, I, I got a little bit of motivation under me and I was taking a look at my, my schedule for, um, just for, you know, what I have going on this summer. And I made the determination that I actually do have enough time now with the, the kids are getting older and I've accomplished most of my sort of hiking goals.

[00:25:38] So I have now signed up to do, uh, adopt a trail. So I wanted to just give a quick summary on that. So I'm, I'm excited for it and it should be a new adventure and I'm hoping I'll learn a lot. But, um, I ended up signing up through the AMC trail adoption program. So I can, I included a link to the, the trail adoption page, I think one or two episodes ago when essentially like there's a list of trails that you can adopt and then you fill out an application.

[00:26:07] So I had selected like three trails, mostly all in the Evans Notch area. Yeah. And then, um, filled out my information and had to, had to read some information about like the expectations. So the commitment is essentially three trips to your trail to do the work. And you can't do any work until you go through the formal training. Wait, three trips in what? A year or six? In a year. It's not bad.

[00:26:35] But essentially, yeah, it'll be like six months because I won't go through training until June and then I can't do any work until after the training. So. Hmm. Interesting. So how many trails are looking for help? We, I had gone over that previously. So there's a bunch of trails in Evans Notch. There's a bunch of trails in the Mahoosic range. There's some in the great Gulf, um, some in the Northern presidentials.

[00:27:02] And then, um, there's a few like obscure trails that I'm not even sure where they are, but there was like probably a list of about 50 different trails that needed to, needed to be adopted. Wow. So, uh, but yeah, so I put my name in, I heard back from the AMC trail coordinator pretty much the next day. And they, they give you an option to sign up for, um, a training class. So there's like four different dates that you can do your training classes.

[00:27:29] Like May, May 11th, which is mother's day, May 30th, which I think is like over Memorial day. And then there's like a couple of dates in June. So I signed up for a date in June to do training. And then I think once you do your training, then it's sort of your, you can dictate your own dates and times when you go and do the work. So, um, I'll plan on going and I'm, I'm going to get something in like Evan's notch.

[00:27:55] I think a section of the bald face trail, bald face circle trail. So it'll be easy for me to go. I can just go from my father-in-law's place and do the work, but I'm excited to learn. There's a, there's a lot of like documentation that they sent over that I'm reading right now and soaking it up like a sponge. Yeah. So do they expect you three times a year to do the entire portion or just hit areas that need the most help or what, what are they looking for?

[00:28:23] I'll, I'll learn more when I do the training, but I suspect, um, that, you know, you'll take different trips with different goals. Like you may want to do brushing one time. You may want to do clearing of water bars and things like that another time. So, um, blow down maintenance. So I'll have to, I'll have to, um, report back after I go through the training. Yeah, that's super cool. Yeah. Wow, man, dude, are you going to get a patch? Another patch? I don't know. I don't, I don't know. I don't think so.

[00:28:52] I mean, I think it's just essentially it's a one year commitment. And then, um, if you want to, if you want to continue working, then you can. And then they also have, um, like floating trail maintenance and they have trail sign inspections and other things that you can do. So if you're interested, I'll put, I'll put in the show notes, the volunteer options again. Um, it sounds like they've got a pretty good, um, level of interest and they've gotten a good number of people signing up.

[00:29:19] And I sort of think like a lot of the concerns around the national park staffing and all that stuff, hopefully that's motivating people to want to give back. Oh yeah. 100%. Yeah. That's cool. I'm going to get you a ghillie hat so you can put all your patches on your, your, your ghillie hat. What's a ghillie hat? You know, you know, those like military green ones with the rim that goes around the entire hat. Yep. Yeah.

[00:29:47] You'd look cool with a ghillie hat with 30 patches on it. I have, I have a lot of patches that are in my, um, I put, I, I put all of our stickers and patches and all the extra stuff that I have. It's in my beer, my, of that beer canister that I got for Yosemite and I've just been pushing, putting everything in there. And I do have like a lot of random stickers and patches and stuff. So it's pretty good collection. Can we go on a little side tangent here for two seconds?

[00:30:16] Uh, agent Sweezy sent a link saying that, um, Yellowstone or is it, or Yosemite? Where's, um, where's the place you went hiking? El Cap and all that stuff. They're getting rid of the reservation system. So now they're anticipating lots of trouble on the links and the cables going up a half dome and all that. No more reserving. Yeah. What do you think about that? It sounds like a recipe for disaster. I don't have to look.

[00:30:44] What's the, are they just doing first come first serve? Excuse me. I think it was backpacker or outdoor one or the other. Maybe we'll deep dive it next episode, but, uh, that late breaking news is going to be a change to the reservation system. Yeah. Okay. I'll check that out. I wasn't aware of that. I didn't see that one. Yeah. Wow. Can you imagine the nice conga line of people? That's probably like a conga line going up half dome anyway.

[00:31:10] It's, well, it's, it is interesting because, um, it's, it's a long hike. I think it's about 10 or 12 miles to get in from the main parking lot. But, and then there's a limited amount of camping spots at little Yosemite, which is, which is close by, but the, um, so, so it's not like people can just rush up there. It is a, it is a, it is an effort to get there.

[00:31:39] So I think that maybe late in the day you might see more crowds, but I'll have to take a look and see. I've got the article here. The deal is here. It is Yosemite. So it's, it's indefinitely suspending its timed entry system, which was initially introduced to manage surging crowds during the pandemic. Um, yeah, they had planned to make the system permanent, but now the future is uncertain. So there you go.

[00:32:09] Thank you, Agent Sweezy. Well, hopefully, yeah, I'll read this article, but I mean, hopefully, yeah, it's not good. Like I said, we talked about this before, like they just took a, like a, a hatchet to the, the, the hiring situation and you know, they are replacing, they are giving headcount for seasonal hires, but I don't think it's the same. Uh, and then also I do wonder, like there's also groups, like we had, we had a guest on that is a, you know, it's a separate organization that's contracted.

[00:32:39] Like those organizations, they are involved in search and rescue and training and other activities. And those may be like the ones that are invisible that you don't realize like, okay, they're not funded anymore. And that's sort of like a shadow headcount that supports Yosemite as well, that may disappear. So it's, it's a mess. This whole thing may be trying to tie in two separate issues. Cause remember we talked about that Booz Allen system and they were getting fees and dah, dah, dah. Right.

[00:33:06] So now they're talking about how it's, people were frustrated with the system to begin with because they couldn't secure reservations. So there might be different layers to this story, but interesting. Yeah. Yeah. I'll do more research on it now and we can talk about it next week. Promise? Um, I promise. I promise. Uh, but Oh, you know what else I had here is, uh, I did want to report back.

[00:33:32] I went to the Boston outdoor expo on Sunday with Mrs. Mike and, and it was really good. I definitely recommend it to anybody for next year. If you're, if you're interested, it was, um, like it was, there was some other convention going on on the front. So it was at the Boston expo, uh, in convention center, which is like right in seaport, South Boston. And, uh, which I've been there a bunch of times for different work things. So it's, it's really easy. It's a big, it's a big place, but it's easy to go and park in the back and get in there. But yeah, it was good.

[00:34:01] They had like, they use the back room or the back convention center and it was like half hiking stuff and then half running. Uh, but I thought the hiking boots were, were very good. They had a bunch of good, uh, good exhibitors there. Cool. Yeah. I think I remember seeing like Walker Stalker convention, big zombie convention there. It's pretty cool time. Yeah. Yeah. It's cool. So I was talking to, um, Mrs. Mike was interested in this, this company in York, Maine that has

[00:34:30] the blow up paddle boards. Yep. So she, she wants to get one of those, those standup paddle boards. So I think I may get her. Yeah. They're very cool. And then there was like speakers in the back. So those were sponsored by like outdoor magazine and innovate sneakers. So they had like, um, Des Linden, who was like a marathon runner. I think she had won Boston before.

[00:34:55] And then, uh, yeah, they had, uh, Dave McGilvery who we know he, he's the, used to be the race organizer and announcer for the Mount Washington road race, but also, um, the Boston marathon. Uh, so he was, he was there and, uh, yeah, they had a bunch of good guests that were speaking and then minus 33 was there. So we're going to talk with John for minus 33 later on. And then there was hemp tone, which is a, I, I wore my sounds like a search and rescue

[00:35:25] sweatshirt snob. So I was getting stopped by a few people. Were you? Which was great. I would get stopped by a lot of people. And it was pretty, it was pretty funny because it was consistent where people would be like, oh, I love that podcast. And I would say like, oh, I'm like, do you have like a, like a guest or a host that you say is your favorite? And every single person answered stomp instead of Mike. Get out of here. Yeah. Every one of them.

[00:35:54] Oh, you're good for my ego. It was a little bit of a blow to the ego, but I was just happy that they listened. That is too funny. Yeah, no, it was cool. It was, it was really amazing. People stopping me and they're like, oh, I love it. And it was, it was great. And then so shout out to hemp tone. Um, so I was talking to her. So she was there for her husband. So the company is called hemp tone. We had given them a shout on our Instagram.

[00:36:21] So they make custom, um, string instruments. So, uh, smaller guitars and they're really high quality. And that was cool to talk to her. She's a listener. And then, um, I talked with this guy, the young man, Croca expeditions, which is like, if you have kids, you know what? This is good for stomp is if you have young kids and you want to go send them to like camp where they do outdoor expeditions, like hiking and stuff, they have a lot of different options for, for kids.

[00:36:50] And then I bought something that I had been looking at for a while and had wanted to buy it before, but had missed. It just didn't find it again. But there's this product called face glove, which is like a, it straps behind, it's sort of like a face mask, but it goes over your nose and it prevents fogging for, um, sunglasses, glasses and goggles. Got it. That's cool. Yeah. So I was talking to the, uh, the, the founder, I think I'm going to have him on.

[00:37:20] He sounds like a fun guy. Oh, that'd be great. Yes. Seems like a good place to meet new guests. Yep. Oh yeah. Definitely a good, good, good time. So you have face glove flex is the name of the, uh, the product. Okay. So we highly recommend the Boston outdoor expo free tickets. You know, you sign up and get a, get free tickets using the, uh, the, the code. So I'll keep an eye on that for next year. Awesome. Any good speakers?

[00:37:49] Anybody from, uh, like search and rescue or anything? I don't know. I didn't look at all the run, all the speaker list. So I'm not sure. Okay. Mrs. Mike liked it though. She, she bought a few things. Awesome. Any chance to shop. That's her thing. Did you guys go out to dinner after? That's a great, great area to go eat. Did we go out to dinner? I'm trying to remember.

[00:38:15] No, we had to get home, but we have, we've gone out and eat there before. We, we did like a winter, a Christmas thing there a couple of months ago. So yeah, I liked that area. Seaport's really built up. I used to work down there before it was built up. It was like just Fidelity. And when I worked at Fidelity, we go, I go there every day, but it was like not built up. So I spent most of my time walking from the Seaport into the financial district to visit clients and stuff. So yeah, it's a beautiful spot, but it's crazy. Yeah.

[00:38:45] It's crazy how built up it is. Yeah. Ready for slashers? Your review. All right, Stomp, you pulled a little bit of gear here, the Silky. So we got to start thinking about blow down repairs as we get into the, the, the spring season. So to talk about this.

[00:39:15] Yeah. You might need this as a trail adopter. This is probably one of the top tier blades you can get the Silky line. They make these cool foldable saws that you can take out for camping and bushwhacking. This one that I have here is called the Big Boy 2000. And it's, when you unfold it, it's like a seven, seven and a half inch blade. So I'm talking if, if you're backpacking and you want to make a fire or cut out some fat

[00:39:43] wood or whatever, this is the blade for you. So we have, have a link for you. It's super hardcore, strong, fairly light. It runs between 0.3 to 0.9 pounds. So it's, it's, it's a little heavy, sure. But if you're going to be doing some heavy backpacking, this is the blade for you. Highly, highly recommended. Great stuff. Yeah. It looks good. It looks good.

[00:40:10] I guess I gotta, yeah, I suppose now with my new hobby, I've got to, I gotta pick one of these up. Oh yeah. So this one, this, this one you have linked here. Stomp actually is 1.1 pounds. Yeah. There's variations in the chart below, which changed the number of teeth and the density of the metal and stuff like that. So you can pick your own version, but that's the rough ballpark. Right. Yeah. So yeah, you can visit the Silky store and get like, get various options. So this is good stuff.

[00:40:39] A pound well spent, I think if you're out there. No doubt. No doubt. So very good. We'll link this in the show notes. People can check it out. Stop. This is the part of the show where we do a dad joke. Oh, what you got? I have something. Well, first of all, I want to give a shout out to Jakester and Julie because Julie is so thoughtful and she got me a dad joke mug that has a QR code where I can get access to the dad joke of the day.

[00:41:08] So I've used it a couple of times, but I actually don't have the mug in front of me, but I wanted to give her a shout out and Jakester as well. I'm sure that he had nothing to do with it, but he did give it to me. So, but very thoughtful Julie. But I, so I will start using the mug when I can next week, but why did Tinkerbell get made of made fun of at school? I give up. She Peter pans. Love it. That's great. Right. Right.

[00:41:37] So for Tinker, that's all I got. That's it. Oh, you want to know? That's okay. Speaking of mugs, I have to mail you or give to you the Mike mug set. There that my daughter Evelyn got us. I still have it. I want that thing. Yeah. It's awesome. It's awesome. I know I got to get, we got to get together. Yeah. Maybe we'll see each other on the 200th episode celebration or something. I don't know. Or a hike. Yeah. Maybe, maybe sooner or a hike.

[00:42:04] So matter of fact, I may be going to, I don't think Washington's going to be in the cards. I may be taking my daughter and her boyfriend and meeting up with my friends Camilla and Lance on Tecumseh for a sledding trip. Oh wow. So maybe I'll, this weekend I'll ping you. I'll let you know. Yeah. Let me know. That's cool. Yeah. So we haven't broken out the sleds this year, so we might try that. Yeah. It's prime time. It is. It is. Cool. Okay. Stomp.

[00:42:32] Now it's time for a sponsor, 48 Peaks. Yes. Use your passion for hiking to help end Alzheimer's. Join 400 plus hikers as they climb New Hampshire's 4,000 footers or create their own challenge to support the mission of the Alzheimer's Association. The annual hiker celebration will take place Saturday, June 21st at Tuckerman Brewing with raffles, food, and an amazing community. Hike that weekend or any day you want this summer.

[00:42:59] No fundraising minimums required, but those who raise $100 will receive the 2025 performance grade purple t-shirt. Let's turn the White Mountains purple to end Alzheimer's. Visit alts.org right slash 48 peaks to learn more. Oh boy. I've been... Every time I talk for a length of time, I feel like I'm just going to cough.

[00:43:26] Like I was sick maybe three weeks ago and I can't shake it. It's just this bronchitis is like just lingering and lingering and lingering. So pardon me. What you got here? Set up the Slasher podcast team. Is this something new I should know about? Yeah, yeah. So let me take over talking stop and you can hopefully have a nice little drink of water. But yeah, I signed... I set up the Slasher podcast 48 peaks Alzheimer's team.

[00:43:56] So yeah, the idea is... So I'm partnering with Nobby, our friend Nobby Hikes. He's been on the show a couple of times, a good friend. So Nobby, his family's been affected directly by Alzheimer's over the last year or two. So I wanted to just partner with Nobby and he's going to be my co-captain. Nice. And I think our plan is that we're going to do a loop over Mount Madison. So I told him, I said, Nobby, this is your hike. I'm going to come along with it. I'm going to be the captain, but I want you to pick the hike.

[00:44:26] So he picked Madison. So we're a little bit more of an advanced hike. Up and over? In case people want to join us. Up and over. Yeah, I think he has a loop. Oh. I think we're going to do like some kind of a loop. I want to say the Brookside Trail. We're going to go up and then come back down Valleyway or A-Line or something. Got it. We are planning. We're going to do it on June 21st and try to get a 10-person team going. And if anybody's interested in joining us, first of all, you have to commit to raising some good money.

[00:44:55] We don't want to be the bottom of the barrel team. We want to be one of the bigger teams to raise money. And so we want people that are going to be like really pushing in on the money thing. But if you're interested, what I will do is I'll put a QR code over the Instagram and my information. And if you want to sign up and be on the team, you can go ahead and sign up. And then once we hit 10 people, then we'll cut it from there.

[00:45:23] Or maybe we'll keep going and we'll do like a smaller hike for people if they don't want to do the Madison thing. We'll figure it out. Yeah, that's exciting. You guys will kill it. Hopefully the weather will be good. So if you're a listener and you want to get involved, you want to go hiking with us, then this is your chance. Yep. Weather should be good by then. Knock on wood. Yeah, yeah. We'll have an alternate option for days and weather and all that fun stuff. You know the deal. You got to be flexible with hiking. Oh, 100%.

[00:45:53] So, hey, listen, we've been selling a bunch of these hoodies still, which is fantastic. So if anybody's interested in getting a slasher hoodie, you can go to the Bonfire Shop on the Instagram link tree. Beautiful colors. We also have classic V-necks and regular tees as well. So check those out. So we have a buy me a coffee donation from, this took me like 20 minutes to figure this one out. So it reads as LaCroix Ave, but it's LaCroix Avery.

[00:46:22] So thank you very much, Avery, I would think, for donating three coffees to the podcast. And she made note that she loves the intro music. That's a good tune. It is a good tune. Water pots. It is. So, all right. What's going on for the beer thing? You still sober, dry and sober here? Oh. I'm drinking. I'm drinking a little bit here. So my friend Paul, when we were in the Bonds, he was talking about a sip of sunshine.

[00:46:52] So Mrs. Mike had went and got me a four-pack of sip of sunshine from Lawson's Finest Liquids. Yeah. So it's an IPA. And I think they get it at Trader Joe's. Had a little bit of a weird, like, dent by the drink here. On purpose? If you can see, it's like, I don't know. I don't think so. I think it's just dented. Huh. So. Oh, you should get a refund. But sip of sunshine. Okay. I don't need a refund. It's pretty good stuff.

[00:47:20] So you gave up drinking after your perch paradise weekend fishing for perch. When I saw that picture online of all you guys lined up on the ice, I almost commented, like, quote unquote, how many people does it take to get one perch? Right. He put it in context. It's so funny. Oh, it's hilarious. It's like, well, 12 linebackers and then me. I was a small old guy compared to them.

[00:47:49] A big, big bunch of guys all got one fish. Oh, it's hilarious. It's so good. So anyway, yeah. I stole one of Mrs. Stomp's blue shine lemonades. This is a, I guess it's a 7% little thing here. It's pretty cool, though. It's made out of Maine wild blueberries and homemade lemonade. Pretty tasty. Thanks, Mrs. Stomp. Sounds good. I owe you. Very good.

[00:48:18] Mrs. Stomp is, she's a national treasure. She sure is. I knew we should have gone left back there. Stomp, don't worry. I know it's this way. I've got a feeling in my gut. Are you sure you're not about to have a bowel emergency? Totally. We got this. But I just blew out my hip. Fell down that gully with my 40-year-old micro spikes. Suck it up, Stomp. It's 4 p.m. We're at 3,500 feet.

[00:48:47] We got nine miles back to the parking lot. Your leg may be broken. We got no cell connection. And we can't feel our fingers. But we're finishing all of my list tonight. By the way, I need some water. I'm empty. I would if I could see what I'm doing. But my headlamp batteries are dead. You got to be kidding me. What a chump. This is the last time I hike with you. Ha. Whatever, mister. Do you know me? I have a podcast. Whatever.

[00:49:16] Let's find out what Mike and Stomp have been hiking. All right, Stomp. So this is the part of the show we talk about recent hikes. We already know your deal. You know, you've been... You have a pass. But you'll start to participate soon. That's right. I did get a chance to go out on a winter hike. So we have a little crew that we've been kind of sticking together. There's people that are coming in. And, you know, it's a nice group. And we actually had a couple of...

[00:49:45] So our friend Dave has joined us previously. And we wanted to get him in because he's a super strong hiker. And then Paul Gamal, who is a listener. And he's been to a bunch of our events. I've always been meaning to get hiking with him. And he joined us as well. So our mission was to get our friend Nick Sidla, who is the co-host for the PUDS podcast and a good friend of ours, good friend of the show. Nick is... He was pushing to get his final summits in for his winter 4,000 footer.

[00:50:15] So his mission was Bondcliffe, Mount Bond, and then West Bond. So we had a crew of seven guys that started off with. So it was, you know, Steve from the Cape, Jake, Peter, Nick, and then Paul, Dave, and myself. So we left Lincoln Woods at about... So it was an out-and-back plan. And we left Lincoln Woods at about 6 in the morning. And we had to wear snowshoes, break trail.

[00:50:45] It wasn't too bad in Lincoln Woods, maybe about four or five inches of snow. So we switched off. But that was pretty easy. So, I mean, you know the deal with the five miles until you get to the split away from the railroad bed. Once we got to the railroad bed, as we started... Yeah, it was fun. I mean, it's always fun going out. It's just brutal going back. You can say that again. Oh, man. And there was supposed to be an AMC crew that was going out and doing the same trip.

[00:51:12] So we were kind of like, hopefully the AMC crew will be ahead of us in case we need to break trail. But we didn't see them. And I don't think that they ended up going out because we didn't see them all day. So we did see a set of tracks when we got to the cutoff where the Bondcliffe trail breaks away from the railroad bed at mile five. And that turned out to be a camper. So there was a solo camper. I think his name was Rob. Because we ran into him. He was ahead of us.

[00:51:42] So there was one set of snowshoe tracks ahead of us. And we met up with him about a mile down the trail. So probably about the six-mile mark. Right around the first water crossing. So there's three water crossings as you go up to Bondcliffe. So I think we ran into him at the first one. Talked for a little bit. And then once we got past the second water crossing, as we started going towards the third water crossing, we started hitting side trail.

[00:52:11] And then the snowpack got significantly deeper. So it went from like four to five inches of breaking trail, which is annoying and a little bit of effort, but not too bad, to like seven to nine inches of breaking trail. But on side hill, which was really difficult because we were slipping down on that side hill. So we probably did. Ascending to Bondcliffe? Ascending, going up. Yeah. Getting closer to like the hairpin and all that. Exactly. Yeah.

[00:52:38] There was like enough snow where we were kind of slipping downhill. It was side hill. That's tough. And it was just kind of annoying. Yeah, it was tough. So we were working.

[00:53:01] So I think that we got six miles in and about, we were going about two and a half to three miles an hour for the first two or three hours. So the pace was pretty good. And looking back at it, I think the mistake that I made was, it was a warm, it was kind of a warm day stomp that day. It was like on Saturday. And maybe you have an opinion on this, but I ended up cramping up. So I had to turn around. Wow. But I'll talk about that later.

[00:53:27] But I think what happened is I wore long underwear and then I wore my heavy, cool, soft shell pants. And I think I was sweating too much on my legs. Possible. Who the hell knows? You were hydrated leading into it? I thought I was hydrated. I'll run down what happened, Stomp, and you can give me your opinion in a minute.

[00:53:49] But essentially, so we got up to the chimney right below Bond Cliff and then the three of the guys were able to get up. They were basically breaking through. We had alternated like breaking trail up and down the different sections. And then ultimately we got to this chimney. It wasn't easy to get up there. And I think I struggled because you had to take a very high step. And I'm a shorter guy. And I think I blew my thigh.

[00:54:16] I really torqued my thigh doing that. That can be the catalyst to trigger those cramps. I've found over the years that it's those big steps where you're forcefully pushing yourself up something that pushes the on button. Otherwise, it would be fine. Maybe that was it. Maybe you just weren't stretched out. I don't know. I don't know because the other thing is, so I had coffee in the morning. I always drink coffee in the morning because I was driving up.

[00:54:43] I got up at four in the morning and then I purposely drank. Like I drank 16 ounces of water. And then I had a Gatorade with me that I was drinking on the hike. And I did have to pee like a couple of times. So I don't know. Maybe like I flushed my system out of electrolytes too much. I don't know. How about your pack? Did you overpack like extra weight? Not really.

[00:55:06] I mean, I carried a liter of water, a thing of Gatorade, 20 ounce of Gatorade. And then I had my thermos. So I don't know. I'm a heavy winter hiker anyway. Yeah. I probably could have dropped some weight. But I think it was that big step up on the chimney that really hurt my thigh. 100%. So it was your quads? Yeah, my quads. Exactly.

[00:55:36] Up to Bondcliffe, I started feeling cramps on my quads. And then, you know, the guys were doing good. We got to Bondcliffe. It was cloudy. And by the time we got to Bondcliffe, our friend Peter, he wasn't feeling great. So he was like, I'm going to slow down. You guys keep going. And he ended up meeting us at Bondcliffe along with the guy Rob. So at that point, there was eight of us. And then Peter had decided, he's like, look, I'm going to go back because I'm not feeling it.

[00:56:06] And, you know, I'm going to head back, which was fine. We figured he'd be at the parking lot and we would meet him because he drove up with Jake. And then, so the seven of us, we picked Rob up. At that time, the clouds cleared on Bondcliffe, which was amazing. That's always a great experience. So you go from like pea soup to like clearing. So we got a bunch of great pitchers. And, you know, Nick was, he went out on the ledge and everything on Bondcliffe and we did our thing. And then it was pretty warm.

[00:56:35] It's probably 35 degrees, no wind. So the cold weather wasn't a problem at all. And then we started heading down Bondcliffe, which was, took two seconds to get down Bondcliffe. And then as we started climbing Bond, I started cramping up and they were, those little flutter clamps got cramps. Terrifying. I was like, I'm going to keep going and this is going to turn into a severe cramp. Yeah. Yeah. It's terrifying. Yeah. I get, I get them every now and then. It's, it's a tough thing to manage.

[00:57:01] I always, that's when I bust out the heavy guns and I break out the, uh, the NASA packet of tuna. And for whatever reason that helps, but it, it really comes down to stretching the hell out of your quads, your sartorius. That's, that's part of the quads, the inner part of the groin down to the knee. Right, right. Oh my God. That's such a nightmare. I hate when that happens. Yeah. And I was like, I kept thinking, I was thinking in my mind, I'm like, oh man, this is Nick's day.

[00:57:29] Like I'm here to get Nick to the finish. And what was his finish? His finish was going to be West Bond. He got a ways to go. So I had like, all right, I've got to climb Bond. Then I've got to climb up West Bond. Then I got to climb back up to Bond and then climb back up to Bond. So I was like, I have four climbs to do and I'm cramping on the, on the second climb. Probably breaking trail too. And breaking trail. So I was like, I don't want to screw it up. Peter's already on his way back. So I was like, maybe I can connect with Peter.

[00:57:59] So I just made the call and said like halfway up Bond. I was like, look, I'm going to turn around. I'm going to go hang out on Bond cliff. I'll wait for you guys as long as I can because it's a pretty warm day and you guys go. So I ended up turning around. I hung out on Bond cliff for about an hour and a half. The weather was beautiful. And then I, I finally saw them on West Bond. I took a picture and then I headed back. But those guys, thank God I didn't go with them stomp because first of all, I would have been cramping up.

[00:58:28] Second of all, those guys ran into these crazy blow downs. Yeah. Um, and they had the crazy blow downs on West Bond and then Nick fell up to his neck in a spruce trap and they had to pull them out. And then the other guy, Rob, there's a picture. He fell up to his shoulders in a, in a spruce trap. Wow. And they were on trail to get on his own. They were off trail. They had to get off trail to go around blow down.

[00:58:58] Oh, I understand. Okay. Wow. And as they were doing that, they fell into spruce traps. So it was crazy. They, they were like, this is insane. So once I saw them on West Bond, I took a couple of pictures and then I headed back. I hiked back solo. I figured those guys were going to be an hour and a half behind me. So I made it back. We dropped beers at the five mile mark. So I stopped and had a beer. Um, and then I just hiked back on my own Lincoln woods. I had to headlamp it out.

[00:59:28] I got back to the car around six 30 and then Peter was there. So I was hanging out with Peter. And then I said, look, I'm going to go to McDonald's. I'm going to get you some food. I'm going to get me some food. And then I'm going to get these guys food. So they have some stuff when they get back. So I booked it down to McDonald's. I let Mrs. Mike know that, look, I'm alive. I'm, I'm coming back later, but I got to wait for these guys to get out. So I got the burgers and I got back, got Peter food.

[00:59:55] And then those guys got out around eight, eight 15 as they walk. I mean, they were the walking dead stomp. I, they, every one of them had like white face. I was able to give them burgers as they came in and they were like, that was the best burger I've ever had in my life. Well, but he did finish Nick. He finished. He got it done. They got it done. So the six of them got it done. Uh, but I will tell people listening, like these, if you do not play around in the bonds,

[01:00:24] the Zeeland bond traverse, the bonds out and back in the winter, like don't go out there by yourself. There was a solo hiker that was behind them by probably two hours or so. We were kind of worried about her because of those spooch traps, but I, apparently she got out. We didn't hear anything, but like, I do not go out there by yourself. If you can find people to hike with, it's very dangerous out there. 100%. Wow. That's impressive. Well, thankfully Nick's like 18, right? So he's got that youthful energy. He's yeah. Yeah. He's younger than that.

[01:00:54] We were all, we're all in our 50s. He's younger than that. He's Nick's like 16, isn't he? Yeah. Well, he does. Yeah. So, but congratulations to him. So, so I think he'll, he'll do a deeper dive on it at the PUDS podcast. So the next episode, check that out for people. But yeah, it was a great, great day. Tough for us old guys, huh? Cramping up. And my legs felt fine. Once, once I got back to Bondcliffe, I ate my chicken parm sub and I drank my Gatorade and my hot chocolate.

[01:01:22] I hung out for an hour and rested and then my legs were fine, but I was going downhill the whole time too. So, well, last time I had that experience was when I was with Nobby and we did his finish for the, the terrifying 25. We went up Madison Gulf, down buttress, up six husbands. And as I was ascending six husbands, that's when I got those flutters. I, I balanced the flutter the entire way out, down Spanx, all the way out.

[01:01:51] It was like a constant battle. I was down to probably a quarter mile an hour pace. It was unbelievable. What a nightmare. Right. I think it was hydration. You don't want to, yeah. You don't want to mess around, especially like it's one thing if you're a mile or two from the parking lot or something, but like being that far out in the middle of winter, you know, not to mention, I don't want to screw his winter finish up. So I was probably could have kept going, but. Crazy. Impressive. Yeah.

[01:02:18] I miss those adverse moments though, but wow. No, no joke. Right. All right. Congratulations, Nick and Jake and Peter and Steve and Dave and Paul and everybody and Rob, the guy we picked up, like congrats to you guys for getting them, getting it done. Yeah, absolutely. So what would have helped on that trip is some coffee, right? Did you have some coffee? That's right. That's right. So next time they should have taken some CS coffee.

[01:02:48] CS instant coffee, athlete ready, www.cs.instancoffee.com. This week we have some notable listeners. If you want to be considered for a notable listener hike of the week, tag us on Insta and we will add you to the list. So we have Dave Schitts and Liz Fay did North North Dinsmore. It was really funny because I was home and Dave was trying to get me out, but I was like, dude, I've done that one. I don't want to walk Sandwich Notch Road.

[01:03:17] But I did give him some 411 as to a parking, a little pull off on Sandwich Notch with a trail that went basically to the summit cone and you just zip right up to the register. So they tackled that. That's pretty cool. Nick and Nature, we just talked about completing his winter 48 on the Bonds. Mega, mega ditto. That's amazing. Dan VDV. I'm sure this is another tough area as well at this time of the year.

[01:03:46] So Carter Dome, South Carter and Middle Carter for 38 to 40 of the winter 48. No joke. That's a tough hike. A hundred percent. Especially adding. So I ended up, I think when I did it, I did South and Middle and I did Carter Dome separately with you. So I didn't have to add that on, but I imagine like adding Carter Dome onto that is like brutal. Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah, it's crazy. And here's another one. Another tough one.

[01:04:16] Dave Hikes and Bikes went all the way out to Owl's Head. And then finishing up halfway point of her grid, Rhonda Willett tagged us for Mount Tecumseh. So what you got here? You got a tough choice this week. This is a... I do. I do. We'll get Rhonda at some point. She's always getting out, so she'll do something cool. But I think Nick gets it for sure. And then I give honorable mention to Dan VDV and then David Hikes for Owl's Head.

[01:04:45] But the Carter's stringing those together. That's a beast mode hike. Yeah, a hundred percent. And then Owl's Head is always tough. So congratulations to Nick, Danny, and David. And there was... Dave Schitz gets nothing. Nothing. Yeah. And there was much rejoicing. Yep. Right. And there was much rejoicing. All right, Tom. So we're going to move into another segment where we are going to talk to John from Minus 33.

[01:05:12] But before we do that, I thought we would do a quick little segment here about... So our listener, Alex Whitaker, sent this in. And he did a great job on this. He was calling out county high points in that... You know, the concept of county high points, but hiking within a state. So the idea is that each state has their own counties. And if you can do the high point of each of those counties, then that's a nice little list for you.

[01:05:42] So he put together a summary of the county high points here, which is pretty cool, Tom, right? Oh, it's super cool. Yeah. Thank you, Alex. It's nice work. Thanks for doing our job for us. You're hired. He gave us a full-on segment here. Right. He's an understudy. He is. He is. We'll have to get him to be a producer on the show here. But it's a good idea. And I was looking through these summits.

[01:06:09] So I actually haven't hiked as many of them as I thought I would here. What's first? But the first one, he starts with Belknap County. And the high point on Belknap County is Belknap Mountain, which is interesting to me. I didn't realize Belknap was the highest in the Belknaps, but I guess it makes sense. I would have thought like Piper or Gunstock might have been. But Belknap Mountain is the highest point at 2,383 feet and gives nice views of Winnipesaukee. I haven't hiked this one yet.

[01:06:37] I've got this one and Piper to do to finish the Belknap range for me. Yeah, I'm pretty certain I tackled that one on my little Piper adventure. Okay. Good stuff. Yep. And then this one will be known to many of us.

[01:06:54] So Carroll County is the highest point in Carroll County is Sandwich Mountain, which anybody that does 52 with a view, it's also known as Sandwich Dome. Right. I guess apparently there is a dispute, Alex writes, about the high point may be different than the actual peak of Sandwich Mountain. So there's a dispute about exactly where it is.

[01:07:21] It may just be like a couple of dozen yards from the peak. Do you know about this stop? I've wandered around up there a little bit. I'm more familiar with the dispute of the height of Sandwich Dome itself, not a surrounding little summit peak. But yeah, that's news to me. Yeah, because I feel like you jump up pretty high on that little section there at the end. Right, right. And so there must be another section where there's some rocks that you can jump up on.

[01:07:51] But I think that you're good. If you did the 52 with a view summit, then I think you're good. Yep. Yep. So the next one is Cheshire County. So that is Mount Monadnock. So Stomp and I have talked about that quite a bit. That's at 3,170 feet. Mm-hmm. And then next up is Coas County, which is Mount Washington at 6,288 feet. So not much to be said there other than, you know, it's the highest summit in New Hampshire period.

[01:08:21] Grafton County is the home of Mount Lafayette, which is at 5,243. This is the high summit of the Franconia Ridge and obviously great views there. However, Hillsborough County offers Pack Monadnock Mountain, which is the smaller mountain near Mount Monadnock. It does have a road to the top of it. And my understanding is it's a great hike.

[01:08:50] It's 2,285 feet. So have you been to Pack Monadnock? I haven't. Not that I'm aware of. I'm very ignorant about that whole area. I've done Monadnock with Nobby, but Pack, I'm not 100% sure. Isn't it north, north of Monadnock? It's in Hillsborough County. I think it's like northeast of Monadnock. Okay. Yeah, I don't think so. One of these days. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:09:15] Merrimack County is Mount Kearsars, which is the, not Mount Kearsars North, which is in the North Conway, but this is in the southern part of the state. Yeah. I've climbed this one. It's 2,934 feet. It's got a nice view of the valley and has a nice fire tower on top of it. It's great. Yeah. It's easy. It's a great Friday night hike. 100%. I remember doing this one with Mr. Stomp because we dropped a car off at an auto place, drove half an hour.

[01:09:45] The hike itself from, it was warmer temps, but it was like half mile to the summit, one of these routes to the top. It was incredible. Really short mileage if you want to get a short hike in or longer, longer trails available too. Right, right. And then the next, so Rockingham County is the next one. So this is a little county close to me. Nottingham Mountain, which is located in Deerfield, New Hampshire. I guess it doesn't have much of a view.

[01:10:12] It's got a rock chimney, Alex States, but there is a viewpoint in nearby Neville Peak to check out. So I may have to check that out. That's close to my area. And then the final two counties, Stratford County, Coppel Crown Mountain, the southwest slope, which is 1,712 feet. And I guess this is a bushwhack off of the main trail to the summit. And I guess this high point doesn't have any views.

[01:10:41] It is located on the side of the mountain marked by a few pile of rocks and a register. So probably on the 500 highest, I would guess. Oh, yeah. Yeah, most of these are, if not all of them. Yep. And then last but not least is Sullivan County Stomp. This is the mysterious Croydon Peak, which I think we've talked about before.

[01:11:03] This is a privately owned hunting preserve. So you cannot hike this. This is inaccessible. And don't try to hike it. Don't say like you listen to this on the Slasher podcast and you wanted to like try to sneak in. And don't do that because it's a hunting preserve and you could get shot. You could get confused for a wild boar. Well, you could get eaten by a wild boar. You could. A bison.

[01:11:33] You could get eaten by a bison. 100%. Yeah. It is a weird place. And I've read about this place. It's a very weird place. So it's about 25,000 acres. It's larger than Manchester, New Hampshire. And it's a privately owned hunting preserve, which is called the Blue Mountain Forest and Game Preserve, also known as Corbin Park. And within Corbin Park, again, this is an exclusive hunting park.

[01:12:03] It is the largest hunting park in the entire country. Wow. And it was founded by a business tycoon in 1889. His name was Austin Corbin. And I guess this guy created Coney Island back in the day.

[01:12:20] And it's a home for extremely famous and wealthy patrons, including Teddy Roosevelt, Grover Cleveland, Herbert Hoover, Rudyard Kipling, Joe DiMaggio, and William Ruger. And they hold exotic animals. And at one point, they had the largest population of bison in the U.S., as it was used to repopulate bisons in the West during the turn of the century. It has elk, wild boar, and pheasants.

[01:12:47] And I guess in the 1940s and 50s, wild boar escaped into the nearby towns. And at one point, a couple of years ago, one wild boar escaped and was hit by a car or so. Ah. Yeah. That's crazy. And within the park, there's Croydon Peak, which is 2,783 feet tall. And this peak has not been hiked since 2013 because new ownership took over the park.

[01:13:15] And it's been over 10 years since anybody's been allowed to be inside this park. Yeah, it's wild. It's a hike. I'm looking at it now. If you pull up Google Earth and look at Croydon and look at the peak itself, it's lined by a massive wall of cliffs. So it looks really interesting. But, you know, this is one of the peaks that is on the 500 highest. And essentially, the word around town and the 500 community is don't even bother at this point.

[01:13:44] And then, of course, there's the wonderful rumor about the one individual that used to work there that was taking payoff money to let hikers sneak in to get the peak. Really? Really? Oh, yeah. A lot of controversy around this place. All right. Well, look. Look, I'm not encouraging anybody. But, like, if... Well, listen. Remember that hermit guy on the Merrimack stomping? Yes. The rich guy offered to buy him a house? Yeah, yeah.

[01:14:13] And I always said, like, if that rich guy's listening to the show, like, buy us a house. But maybe somebody that's involved in this hunting preserve is, like, listening. And if they wanted to let, like, me and you come in and do a special secret surprise for the listeners, that would be great. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. So... Anyway, but anyway. So that is Corbin Park, Croydon Peak, and the secret hunting preserve. New Hampshire is such an odd and interesting place, Stomp. It really is.

[01:14:43] So wild. It's like another world. Yes. So crazy. So, anyway. But another unique New Hampshire thing is right now minus 33. So we've got John from minus 33 is going to join us right now, Stomp. So let's get into that segment. All right. This is going to be awesome. Be-do-do. Be-do-do-do.

[01:17:16] All right. I'm hitting record. All right, John. We are live now. So anything you say can be used against you. So just be warned now. Okay. I've been warned. Properly warned. That's right. Yeah. Now, have you ever done a podcast before? I've done a couple of them. Yeah. You've done a couple of them. All right. Yeah. But not a video podcast. Okay. Great. Yeah. So we're just going to push out audio, but we like to see each other when we're talking so we can get cues. You know, I think it's a great idea. It works good.

[01:17:46] I was kind of trained during COVID. Yeah. You know. Exactly. The office was empty and this was the only way to communicate. Exactly. I mean, we're not much to look at, let's be honest. Like, it is what it is. Yeah. Yeah. But welcome. So for the listener, Stomp, why don't you kick it off? You're the man that wrangles all of our guests. So why don't you just give a quick summary of who John is and how this came to be? Yeah. Well, it's a good question, actually.

[01:18:15] I think we've tried to get you guys on in the past, but there must have been some miscommunication or something. But some up and coming events in the search and rescue world brought us together again. And I thought we would kill two birds with one stone and get you on the show so you could talk about all the good that you do for the community and for search and rescue. And yeah, you were kind enough to agree to jump on with little hesitation, little hesitation.

[01:18:45] Oh, no, I'm excited. I'm excited. Awesome. So, John, why don't you start? So, John's here with Minus 33. So, John, why don't you start just by introducing yourself personally, talk a little bit about your background. And then before we get into Minus 33, we're going to talk about that, but just maybe a little bit about your early life and your exposure to outdoor activities and the New Hampshire, New England area. Okay. So, this will be the first hour and 15 minutes, and then we'll go to the next hour. All right. All right.

[01:19:14] You've got to be concise. Concise. Yeah. So, I've grown up in central New Hampshire, Ashland, the town where Minus 33 is located. Went to high school in town and went off to college, got my textile engineering degree, came back and worked at the local mill, the family company. We had 300 employees.

[01:19:36] We manufactured woolen broadcloth for the high fashion industry out of New York City, sold all the big names. And then in around 2000, our great government gave away all the textile jobs, and all our cut-and-sewers and our garment guys all left the country. And so, we had to close down the big plant.

[01:20:04] And at about that time, I got fooling around with wool base layer. And kind of as I was closing one company, I tried a lot and only had one success. So, Minus 33 was a success. And along with a couple other lieutenants at the company, we brought it up from nothing up to where we are today. Awesome.

[01:20:31] And were you, in your time growing up, were you like a hiker, snowmobiler, skier? Did you do a lot of outdoor activities? Yes. I was primarily hunting and fishing. I never got into the sports world. It always seemed to be during either hunting or fishing season. So, I was just outside all the time. Cutting firewood, working gardens. I do that all the time. I still cut all my own firewood.

[01:21:01] You know, so... Want to come over and cut mine? Yeah. More than welcome. I like to order my firewood. I do stack it, but not cutting. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So, before Minus 33 came to be, so there was obviously an evolution. So, there's like, it's kind of top of mind for me because there's all this talk about like, you know, manufacturing jobs and like, oh, we're going to bring these jobs back.

[01:21:26] And I have to imagine it's not as simple as just flipping a switch and bringing these jobs back. So, they went away. You said around 2000. Is there anything you can talk about as far as your perspective on, you know, what manufacturing was like prior to 2000 and what happened to sort of make it go away and your perspective on like, how realistic is it to bring these jobs back?

[01:21:51] So, the woolen industry, which is where I was brought up, we had big equipment, big manufacturing, large volumes. It takes years and years to train textile workers to run this big equipment and whatnot. And I really don't see that coming back because it's very high labor orientated.

[01:22:16] Sock making, which we make socks in Ashland now. Five years ago, we bought our first sock machine and basically taught ourselves how to make socks. But with the automation that's available on a sock making machine today, we don't need that much labor. We still need labor.

[01:22:42] But a lot fewer people than you did 20 years ago. So, automation is the way jobs are going to be brought back, in my opinion, especially in the textile world. It's amazing what these new machines can do. You know, they're $40,000, $50,000 a piece. They sit there and they just turn out sock after sock every five minutes. It's fascinating. Absolutely fascinating. Wow.

[01:23:10] So, the work involved would be more around supporting the equipment that helps with automation. So, not as many jobs, but probably a little bit more technical. Yes. Yes. We have mechanics. Well, they call them technicians today. Distribution. Quite skilled technician. Yeah. And then we have just down packaging, inspection, labeling, stickering. You know, there's not a lot of skill involved in that.

[01:23:40] But it's a job for somebody. And then, you know, for minus 33, then it's all the marketing and the sales and trying to design the right thing and get the right color. And, you know, because Todd, my second lieutenant, and I, both are textile engineers and been here for quite a while, we understand wool yarns and nylon yarns, synthetic yarns. We understand how you make something.

[01:24:08] And so, we're able to go out in the world and search and understand what will help make a better sock. And, again, we taught ourselves how to make socks. So, when you were thinking through, like, all right, I want to start something new, and minus 33, you know, has been successful, what was the – can you talk through sort of the

[01:24:35] history of that and how you came up with the product lines that you eventually settled on? Well, it was – I'd like to say it was well-organized, planned, and mapped out, but it's not. These things in life just kind of happen, and they're presented to you, and, you know, there's a Y in the road, and you just take the right turns enough times, and you end up on top of the pile.

[01:24:59] So, in around – I think it was maybe 1998, something like that, a friend of mine gave me some wool underwear base layer. He was actually doing some consulting work for a competitor of ours, and I liked it so well, I bought $1,000 worth of it, and I gave it out to my hunting buddies, and said, what do you think of this, guys? Nice.

[01:25:22] And then the next year, I bought some more and started selling it, and Todd works with me. Slowly, we said, oh, we've got to package it. We've got to sell it. We've got to do the – you know, and we just learned and just sold more and more and more and more every year, you know? Yeah, and as a hiker, like, I mean, it's sort of – we just take it for granted, like

[01:25:48] the materials we generally look for, you know, wicking synthetic or merino wool. What is it about merino wool that is so beneficial for outdoor activities? Okay, so it's the warmth part of it, and if it gets wet, it stays warm. You know, you might be uncomfortable if you're wet, if you fall on a brook in the winter or something, if you've got enough wool on.

[01:26:14] If you can get up and move or get yourself to a fire, you're going to be okay. You know, if you've got something like a synthetic, which is – conducts the cold, it just sucks the heat out of you, where the wool just traps that heat right in, and you'll be hotter than before you fell in the brook in a few minutes. It's impressive, you know?

[01:26:41] And, you know, from your search and rescue side of things, the ability of the fiber to, you know, not support combustion if somebody gets themselves burned or something like that, you know, that goes a long ways. If you've got a plastic thing on or a cotton thing on, it supports it, and it's going to either burn or it's going to melt on you with the wool.

[01:27:09] You know, you can burn it with a blowtorch, but it just goes out. It won't support combustion. And, you know, that with its heat maintaining and the ability is just great for survival. And you're more likely to wear something and use something if it's comfortable. And wool today is very comfortable. And in addition, you're not going to put something in your wardrobe that takes a lot of maintenance

[01:27:38] or care or special care or whatever. And wool today, we're able to make it so it's, let's say, user-friendly. You can easy care. You can just put it in the laundry with all your regular bits and pieces that you normally wash. Wash them and dry them the same. Don't dry them on high heat, but just handle them like regular garments. They come out. They don't shrink. They don't deteriorate.

[01:28:07] You know, if you've got something with you that, you know, is always in your closet, is always there, you're going to use it, and it's going to provide you an awful lot of safety, speaking from your side of things. If you've got it on, you've got one of your safety items on. Okay. And what is it that makes your fleece particularly comfortable?

[01:28:34] Do you have special sheep in the factory, or how do you source the wool? Yes. So that goes all the way back to my training. You know, for 50 years, we've known wool and sheep, and we're able to select the fibers that meet the needs.

[01:28:52] And so wool is, it's a natural fiber, and there's a big variety of diameter and coarseness, roughness, flexibility. There's a lot, an awful lot that goes into the fibers, definition and whatnot, but we use what's generally called merino wool. And that's in 17 to 22, 23 micron diameter.

[01:29:20] I know a lot of your listeners probably don't understand what that is, but it's finer than a human hair. And fine fibers, real fine things, tend to bend easy, and if they bend easy, they're soft. If it's really hard, let's say it's a 30 or 40 micron fiber, that would be great for making carpets, where if you're walking on them, the fibers don't bend over and go flat. They've got a lot of spring to them.

[01:29:49] But if it's really coarse fiber, it becomes stiff and scratchy and is very uncomfortable. So our merino wool is very soft, and when it's against your skin, it feels really good. Yeah, and I feel like a lot of us kids that grew up in the 70s and 80s, we got exposed to that uncomfortable wool back in the day, but it's different nowadays. It certainly is.

[01:30:15] Grandmother's old hand-knit sweater was, you wouldn't want that against your skin. And today... I remember itching my neck at church, John. Exactly, exactly. And, you know, today we've got... We sell just tons of men's and women's underwear, boxer briefs, ladies' briefs. We sell thousands of pairs of that stuff, and people put it on. It's our product. It's the first thing you put on in the morning. It's the last thing you take off at night. It's comfortable.

[01:30:44] And it's because the moisture-wicking ability of wool just sucks the moisture away from your body. Of course, moisture makes you cooler when you suck it away. But it also prevents you from getting cold if you don't have the moisture against your skin. You asked earlier, I'll go loop back around to what makes our wool great.

[01:31:11] If it's next to your skin, we want to have a really fine fiber, but a real fine fiber is usually a little less durable. So, if we go to a second layer piece, we go up in the micron, we get a little bit stiffer fiber. It's not uncomfortable, but it's a little more rugged, a little more durable. And then, if we have like a hoodie or something that's completely out of wear, we'll move up on the micron and make it even tougher.

[01:31:39] And, you know, we make a buffalo plaid wool shirt with, you know, really, you know, 30 micron wool. And that's as tough as nails. It probably lasts you a lifetime. You won't wear that out. But it... Got it. So, if I'm understanding this, so you have like, so your expedition weight, that's a higher micron.

[01:32:03] And then, you get down to like micro weight is sort of on the even finer end. And those have different like softness levels, I would assume. Yes. And so, it's a juggling act, you know. We'd make everything out of super fine wool if we could because it would be more comfortable and whatnot. But it's not going to be as durable. So, you've kind of got to balance durability with comfort.

[01:32:31] But, so our super fine micron base layer, when we want to go even lighter, we have to put a little bit of nylon with it to help hold it all together so that we can get down even lighter weight. So, you know, for you hikers and whatnot that, you know, you guys are really weight conscious and whatnot. So, you don't have to lug those extra ounces around with you all day long. But you still get the comfort and the beauty of having wool on.

[01:33:02] No, that makes sense. That makes sense. And then, so I just want to make sure that the listeners understand like you guys are not just socks. I mean, that's what, I think that that's sort of my first exposure to Minus 33 was socks. I've got a couple of pairs, super comfortable. But also, it's base layer, underwear. You have like quarter zip, long sleeve shirts that are outerwear as well. So, you have a full line of solutions. You also have headwear.

[01:33:30] You have like balaclavas and neck gaiters and the whole thing. And those are super comfortable because one of the things I've known, for years, I used like the cotton, I think, balaclavas with the, I forget what that material is. It's like a, it's an artificial material or a synthetic material and it just like rubs your nose and your face. But the wool balaclavas are going to be more comfortable over your nose, right? Yes, yes.

[01:33:55] Yes, we make all kinds of hats, course count hats, thin hats, pretty hats, scarves. We make a variety of gloves. We even make a nice, real nice leather ski glove today, which we just introduced this year, which has the insulating value inside between the two layers of leather is actually wool.

[01:34:24] So, we get the benefits of wool tucked away inside a glove. They're quite comfortable. We're really, we're the wool guy, you know. Yeah, no, it's great. I love those, those, I call those the sort of work gloves. You know, you look at them and they sort of look like the traditional work gloves, but they're really heavy duty and nice. So, I may have to, I may have to add that to my collection next year. Okay. We've got a bunch of them, so help yourself.

[01:34:55] Awesome. And then from your perspective on socks, I have my original, when I first started hiking, I used to like, I didn't know any better. And I would like double up on socks and I would have like a, two thick pairs of socks and then I'd shove them into my boots. And I didn't have any circulation going on on my feet. My feet would get cold and I would say like, well, maybe I'll add a third sock or something. But over time, what I've discovered is that you're much better off going with a mid-weight sock and a more insulated boot.

[01:35:24] And I think that, you know, you guys offer a real good selection of mid-weight and lightweight liner socks that go along well with like a full hundred insulate gram boot for winter hiking. Can you talk a little bit about like the weighting on your socks and how you go about designing those? Yeah, so you're completely correct when you talk about doubling socks up and whatnot.

[01:35:48] But if you're going on a hike or you're going on a climb or something you're really getting out there, you really got to make sure that you got the right boot. It's got to be the right size. And you won't know, you won't get the right size unless you decide what kind of socks you're going to have on. If you're going to have a lightweight sock, then you need the boot to fit the lightweight sock.

[01:36:16] If you're going to have a 400 gram mountain boot and you're going to be winter climbing or cold weather going, you're going to want to have a thicker sock on. You're going to have like one of our expedition socks. So that's the sock you want to go into the dealer and have your boot fitted to that. The last thing is what you want to happen is what you described is too much sock in the boot shuts off circulation. You get a cold foot.

[01:36:43] Too little sock, you start rubbing back and forth. You get blisters. Both of them can end a big trip right away. I have some friends that swear by liners. We've actually, we're developing a liner sock, which is just a very thin, thin liner. It has some wool in it and you put that on first and then you put your other mid-weight sock instead of your expedition weight sock. So you have two socks on.

[01:37:13] And if your feet are prone to blisters or you're really worried about maybe a new set of boots or something, this gives you the extra ability to fend off blisters. Because the liner sock is going to stick to your foot and it's going to stay there. And your boot and your other sock is going to slide back and forth against it, not against your skin. And it won't burn up a blister on you.

[01:37:42] Still, if you've got the wrong boot, you're still going to have trouble. But there's a whole science to socks and footwear. So we have got very lightweight socks and we've got our expedition socks and everything in between. We tend to design socks to fit. That may mean that you're going to have to take a half a minute more when you slide your sock on.

[01:38:11] It's not just something you just pull on and let go and it's on. You're going to have to slide it on. You're going to get your foot into it. But once you've got your foot into your sock, it stays there. It doesn't slide down. You don't have to stop, take your boot off and readjust your socks again. And we put as much wool as we possibly can into the sock and still have enough stretch and nylon and all the other fibers and whatnot that go into making a sock.

[01:38:40] But we want to have high wool content socks. So if you get them wet or if you're going to wear them for a long time, maybe you go out for three or four days at a time, you've got that pair of socks. If you've got a high synthetic content sock, it's going to stink to high heaven. You're going to have to leave it outside the tent at night.

[01:39:02] Whereas if you've got a high wool content sock, I don't know if you do it, but at night in the tent, you take that sock, you take those socks, take them off your feet, throw them in the bottom of your sleeping bag. And a good pair of wool socks will be dry in the morning. I don't know how it happens, but by God, they're dry. You put them back on where if you've got a synthetic or a cotton sock or something, you try that to just wet noodles in the bottom of your sleeping bag.

[01:39:32] Right. So we're getting into mud season soon enough. Like the snow will be gone and we'll be doing it. Basically, most of the hikers will switch over to trail runners, which are sneakers with traction on them. And then they'll go to the low ankle socks. So what you're saying is if you don't want to, so Stomp, his feet are disgusting. So he needs a new pair of socks because he's always, he's very sweaty as it is. But what I'm hearing then is that the best move is to get these wool trail running ankle socks.

[01:40:01] And then maybe your feet won't stink as much. Although I'd like to test that on Stomp because he would be the ultimate test for you guys. Yeah, well, we'll get you a pair and we'll have him test it. Okay. All right. But you can smell them afterwards. I'm not going to. Yeah. Yeah. It's, yeah, so. Speechless. He's like, what kind of podcast is this? Yeah.

[01:40:26] So I'll just tell you, I had a, I went, what was it, six years ago, I did an Alaskan sheep hunt. Oh, wow. In the Alaskan range. And we would start out at 2,000 feet. We'd hike to 5,000 feet. We'd hike to 5,000 feet, hunt all day, come back at night. And it was early fall so it didn't get dark until around 10 o'clock at night. And then you'd crash, eat lots of food, crash, get up and go and do it. We did it 10 days in a row.

[01:40:56] And I ran about three different pairs of socks and I never got a blister. I wore, that was a 400 gram insulated boot. It, I don't know. The socks just did the job, you know. They did it. So, well, so the listeners should be picking some of these up for sure. And John, can you talk about the partnerships that you, so you guys, not only are you a local company,

[01:41:26] but you also work in sponsorship with the New Hampshire Outdoor Council. You're associated with the Hike Safe Program. You've helped supply search and rescue teams and then you're also involved with other organizations that are involved with skiing and other outdoor activities. So can you talk a little bit about the philosophy of the company and how you've evolved to be a partner with all of these different organizations? You know, the search and rescue came about.

[01:41:56] I had a friend, a forest warden that worked in our area that I knew quite well. And he was in visiting, buying Minus 33 product. And he said, you know, he said, when we go into the mountains and we haul somebody out, said, if we get in there and we're worried about them going into shock or something, said, we take our clothes off and we put it on them to get them out and save them.

[01:42:25] And he says, we never get our clothes back. And I said, well, why don't we just give you some base layer? And we did that a few times and it really, really helped. So, you know, like I said earlier, you try something, it's a Y in the road, and you pick one way and off you go and it's a success. So the search and rescue kits that we send out, we can't keep up with the demand,

[01:42:55] but we get stories all the time of somebody that was in tough shape and they jammed some base layer on them. And, you know, there's hats, socks, tops, bottoms. You know, it's something that you, as a rescuer, you've got something in your kit that you can deal right away with a wet, soggy, miserable body. And like I said, even if they ultimately get that base layer wet,

[01:43:23] at least you help saving their life. And it's light, too. Those packages are very light. And they're not a burden to carry up trail. Yeah, yeah. And then, you know, the other conservation-orientated organizations that we support, it's, I don't know, it's just the right thing to do.

[01:43:51] I don't, you know, it's not a great philosophy or anything. It's not anything special. But, you know, we try to support the outdoors. We try to, I personally feel that the more people we can get outside doing things, they're going to help protect our forests, our parks, our resources, our access. If we lock everybody up in apartments in downtown New York,

[01:44:20] how can we expect them to come to us when we need some help in the forest or defending trails or building trails or whatever you need out in the part of the wilderness where you go, we need to educate the whole population where conservationists. Right, right. No, that's appreciated. And, you know, hopefully the listeners will support you guys like you've been supporting the hiking community.

[01:44:51] Question for you. So, obviously, like anybody can go online to your website, which is minus33.com. But also, you have a presence with retail stores as well. Can you talk a little bit about some of your retail options? Yes, we have somewhere around 700 brick-and-mortar stores in the country. We have a few up in Canada and some in other parts of the world, but generally most of them are right here down the lower 48.

[01:45:24] These brick-and-mortar guys are great people, great organizations to get the word out. Not everybody goes online. Not everybody Googles. People want to walk into a store, feel the product, maybe try it on, talk to the clerk behind the desk. Hopefully we've educated them well enough so that they can at least help you pick out the right product.

[01:45:50] So, they are an important part of our business, our brick-and-mortar guys. They're fantastic. Yeah. Awesome. And then, so, John, I have a confession to make. I hope you don't think less of me, but I am a Massachusetts resident. So, whenever I have the opportunity to get a real, true New Hampshire person. Stomp's a New Hampshire guy, but he's a blow-in from Massachusetts, so he's not a real. He's a flatlander, too.

[01:46:20] But in and around Ashland, do you have any secret tips that you want to share with the listeners around cool places to eat or hikes that they may not think about? Any good secret tips for people that want to go around the Ashland area? Well, I'll tell you, around Big Squam, Little Squam, Big Squam, our lakes and our area are holding this Ashland area.

[01:46:47] We have a small hiking range called the Squam Range. It's a 12 or 15-mile hike. It's down a whole bunch of little ridges and knobs and stuff like that with some beautiful views. That's a really good place to go.

[01:47:04] It's easy, well, for local people anyways, it's easy for us to get to a trailhead and go to a couple peaks or go to the Firelander Sandwich and hike your butt off, do your 12 miles and drop dead at the end of it. Right. And then where do you go to eat afterwards? Well, you know, right here in Ashland we have the Common Man Restaurant, which is terrific. That's great.

[01:47:31] Alex Ray that started the Common Man Restaurants, I think he's got 14 or 15 of them up and down the state. He's been very successful. But the one in Ashland was the first one he opened in 1972 or 3, something like that. I may not have got that. In that neighborhood anyways. Anyways, just down to earth, good grub, good friends, you know, nice and easy. We have in Holderness, we have a little place called Walter's Basin on the lake, which is kind of nice.

[01:47:59] You know, it's got a nice little bar and looks out over the lake, so it's kind of nice. There's some more sophisticated places in and around, but I don't generally go there. I just go to the... Nice. Those sound like good options. And then what's the future for Minus 33? Do you see yourself expanding product lines or do you think you're just going to continue to focus on what your core product lines are?

[01:48:28] What's your thoughts about the future? So first of all, a few years ago, I'm 69 years old, by the way. And a couple years ago, my son Lawson joined the company and I got him out of a database thing that he was doing. God only knows what it was. He's educated too much. But anyways, he's actually the president of the company now.

[01:48:56] I'm the vice president and I like to tell everybody that Lawson can do anything he wants with the company as long as I agree. But anyways, he's going to carry on the company when I'm not as active. So Minus 33 is going to continue. We basically continue to expand by selling our existing product line to more and more people.

[01:49:24] We have some really basic products like our mid-weight tops and bottoms. We just sell a lot of them and it's very, it's just what most people that are getting started need. So we're always going to have those products. We add a few colors. We've added the micro-weight with some synthetic in it to get the lighter weight, which seems to be where we're going as maybe the world warms up.

[01:49:54] But anyways, we got lighter weight products and we really moved into the headwear in the last four or five years and expanding in that area. These new ski gloves, that's a new thing. Anything to do with wool and we're going to continue to develop new products. I don't even know which ones. We've always got, you know, you always got eight or ten items on the desk and we try them.

[01:50:19] And, you know, a small percentage of them make them into the marketplace and some just don't make it. But we're going to continue to grow. We're going to continue to serve. We've got excess capacity in sock making right now. So we'd like to expand that, whether it's new socks or whether it's just more of the existing ones. We're a busy little shop. You know, stuff's happening. Yeah. Yeah, no, it's great.

[01:50:48] And I like to buy all kinds of hiking gear. So I will continue to support you guys with socks and hats and all kinds of stuff. So I appreciate your products and I appreciate you coming on, John. And it's a cool story. Always great to connect with a local company that's being successful. And thank you again for the support that you've extended to the hiking community, search and rescue, and all that you do. My pleasure, Mike. My pleasure. Awesome.

[01:51:17] Stop, anything that you want to cover before we let John go and have his dinner for the evening? Yeah, how did you get the name? Minus 33. So we knew we had to have a name at some point because I was just selling underwear and we had to have a name, you know. And I had a, when we had the big mill, it was still running.

[01:51:44] I had a maintenance boss who was a clever, sharp, sharp young guy. And we all sat around the room, maybe six or eight of us, and said, geez, we've got to come up with a name. And we'd toss names around. Well, we liked, because we did some snowmobile suits and we did some other stuff which didn't make it. But cold weather is where we were kind of focused with wool at the time. And one of the ideas was thrown out, well, we'd like to be like minus 40.

[01:52:13] And minus 40, of course, is where Fahrenheit and centigrade are the same temperature. I don't know, just like to have that. Well, when you Google it and you try to find out if you can get that domain name, you couldn't get it. And my mechanic said, well, you know, 33 sounds good. And we said, yeah, all right. So, you know, you type that up and then you check it. So, oh, we can have it. Boom. We got it. There you go. Makes sense.

[01:52:39] Yeah, so that goes back to our cold weather roots. But like I say, we're doing more lighter weight goods, more summer goods, summer stuff. A lot of people don't understand that wool keeps you cool in the summer, too. Oh, yeah. You know, it's a little trade secret that a lot of people don't like, I believe. But, yeah, I wear a wool T-shirt all year round right in the middle of the summer and it keeps me cooler than that old wet sticky cotton thing or that plasticky thing.

[01:53:09] Would you consider making a special run for me of like an old school Joe Dodge 10th Mountain Division, like one inch thick wool pants or something? Yeah. Yeah, so we're working with a company that actually makes them in America, a beautiful heavyweight wool. I call it Johnson woolen type or Filson type pant.

[01:53:37] I don't know if we're not going to be there right away, but our first inroads into that, which was a year and a half, two years ago, was our wool shirt that we made, a plaid shirt. Our green and black, red and black, and an all-gray version of it. That's our first step forward. We'll follow it up with a pair of pants in a few years and whatever we make is going to be really, really good.

[01:54:05] And those heavy pants that you're talking about, 24 rounds, 80 wool, 20 nylon. Messing around. They'll last a lifetime. 100%. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's exciting. Yeah, especially, yeah, yeah. For, you know, you guys that are outside, you know, either running heavy equipment or if you're ice fishing, standing still in the wind, you know, man, that's, nothing beats it. Yeah. Sounds good. I'll make a pair. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Stop. Leave him alone.

[01:54:34] He's busy. He's busy. We'll wait for you to come up with the retail. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead. It's all good. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, John. And we'll let you get back to your evening. And yeah, this has been great. All right. It was a lot of fun. Thank you very much. Thanks. Cheers. All right, Stomp. So, excellent. I got to go shopping now.

[01:55:04] That was great. I feel like I need even more base layer, even more socks. Yeah. It's amazing. It's really cool. They just honed in on this thinner version of the old school wool. I love it. It is. Yeah. It's great. Yep. I feel like we've got a nice opportunity to talk with some of the larger local businesses around the area, Lohutz and Minus 33. So, it's been really great. And John's a great guy.

[01:55:31] So, definitely encourage everyone to support Minus 33 and all the local companies around here. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. They do a great job. Yeah. And Stomp, I think we've run out of time. I had another segment where I was going to highlight for AT through hikers the advice for entering New Hampshire, but I think we'll push that to next episode. We've already got a segment in the can for our next episode, Stomp, but we've run out of time on this one. So, we'll call this a night. All right. Until next time.

[01:56:01] Until next time. Adios. Thank you for listening. If you enjoyed the show, you can subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podbean, YouTube, or wherever you listen to podcasts. If you want to learn more about the topics covered in today's show, please check out the show notes and safety information at slasherpodcast.com.

[01:56:27] That's S-L-A-S-R podcast.com. You can also follow the show on Facebook and Instagram. We hope you'll join us next week for another great show. Until then, on behalf of Mike and Stomp, get out there and crush some mega peaks. Now covered in scratches, blisters, and bug bites, Chris Staff wanted to complete his most challenging day hike ever.

[01:56:55] Fish and game officers say the hiker from Florida activated an emergency beacon yesterday morning. He was hiking along the Appalachian Trail when the weather started to get worse. Officials say the snow was piled up to three feet in some spots, and there was a wind chill of minus one degree. And there's three words to describe this race. Do we all know who they are? Oh, yeah! Here is Lieutenant James Neeland from New Hampshire Fish and Game. Lucinda, thanks for being with us today. Thanks for having me.

[01:57:25] What are some of the most common mistakes you see people make when they're heading out on the trails to hike here in New Hampshire? Seems to me the most common is being unprepared. I think if they just simply visited hikesafe.com and got a list of the ten essential items and had those in their packs, they probably would have no need to ever call us at all.