Episode 232 - Pemi Black Bear update, Hiker Fatality, Brush Fires, USFS HQ Move, Belknaps, Greylock, Kinsmans, SAR News

[00:00:08] Here is the latest Higher Summits forecast brought to you by our friends at the Mount Washington Observatory. Weather above treeline in the White Mountains is often wildly different than at our trailheads. Before you hike, check the Higher Summits forecast at mountwashington.org.

[00:00:31] Weather observers working at the non-profit Mount Washington Observatory write this elevation-based forecast every morning and afternoon. Search and Rescue teams, avalanche experts, and backcountry guides all rely on the Higher Summits forecast to anticipate weather conditions above treeline.

[00:00:51] You should too. Go to mountwashington.org or text FORECAST to 603-356-2137. Hello listeners! Nick here with your forecast for the weekend of May 9th, 2026. Friday. In the clouds early, trending in and out of the clouds under mostly cloudy skies late.

[00:01:21] Slight chance of morning snow showers, then chance of snow showers in the afternoon. Possible additional snow accumulations of a trace to one inch. High in the upper 20s. Wind northwest shifting west at 30-45 mph early, decreasing to 25-40 mph.

[00:01:55] Wind chill falling to 0-10 mph. And Saturday. In the clear under increasingly cloudy skies, trending into the clouds. A slight chance of morning snow showers, then a chance of snow in the afternoon. Possible additional snow accumulations of a trace to two inches. High in the lower 30s. Wind west shifting south at 25-40 mph with gusts up to 50 mph. And wind chill rising to 10-20 above. So again, looking a bit snowy leading into the weekend. Stay safe out there. Hopefully you can get something in.

[00:02:24] Happy hiking. Go cross the peaks.

[00:03:01] Broadcasting from the Woodpecker's studio in the great live, free or die state of New Hampshire. Welcome to the Sounds Like A Search And Rescue Podcast. Where we discuss all things related to hiking and search and rescue in the white mountains of New Hampshire and beyond. Here are your hosts, Mike and Nick.

[00:03:24] All right, we're live. Episode 232. This is the episode when Nick has the technical issues. Yes, yes. It's been a challenge. I think that was four times trying to join WebEx and coming back in and out and browsers and all that fun stuff. New laptop. So exciting. Well, you do.

[00:03:53] Issues. Thanks. Okay, so we've got... What do we have for witty banter here? So let's do a Where's Dave update, Nick. That sounds great. These updates are going to be a week? A week behind as actual? Is that right? Yeah. I think now. I think it'll be... More than a week. It'll be like a week and a half. It'll be like a week and a half. It'll be, yeah, a week and a half, two weeks, I guess, technically. Yeah, from when it comes out, it'll be like a week and a half. You're right. Right.

[00:04:20] Because we're recording this on the 28th and then this will come out on May 8th. Yes. Yeah, so it'll be about a week and a half. He's still in the ballpark of where we're talking about. Right. Right. So where is he? So as of today, Dave is in Virginia. He said the terrain is much more gentle at times. Calf is behaving with the adjustment in speed, so that's good. Few other things on a daily basis, but no pain, no main. I'm hoping to hit mile 600 by the end of the week.

[00:04:50] A very close lightning strike at camp last night. Hopefully I kept the right amount of cold weather gear. It's looking mid to low 30s four nights this week with rain. A lot of people have been reaching out on Instagram and I really appreciate it. Thank you. I also took a moment of silence for Stomp's hip, which is no longer with us. May it rest in peace. And a new double hip replacement. Stomp hit the mountains again soon. Excellent. So, yeah, yeah.

[00:05:16] So Stomp also just in Stomp news, we are Stomp update. Yes. Stomp had his hip surgery yesterday. He sent us a picture of him sitting on a toilet with his... He did. Was he in his underwear or was it just like a gauze thing wrapped around his hip? I believe it looked like a combination of gauze and I asked him what it was and he was saying it was like compression sort of sleeves to prevent blood clots. It sounded like with him kind of, I imagine being immobilized for a bit and maybe the

[00:05:42] surgery, but it sounds like it went smoothly, smoother than even the last time he did it. So hopefully he has a nice speedy recovery. We wish you all the best Stomp. Yes. Yeah. I thought wishing you the best Stomp. And I think I'm guessing that like the mental uncertainty around like, oh, what's going to happen? Like he's already gone through it. So he's probably got a leg up on some other patients because he knows what to expect. But I appreciate Mrs. Stomp taking the picture, but like she didn't have to take a picture of him on the toilet and send it to us. Yeah.

[00:06:11] I was saying it was nice of her to document the fact in the moment, I guess, to share with us. Yeah. I didn't spend much time researching it, but he's in good spirits. He's been texting us and we had a little text group going on with Dave as well. So everybody's in good spirits now, although Stomp did say that he misses his hip. He said he had a good 56 year run with the hip, but you know, time for a new one. Yeah. It's good. I know he was, uh, he was definitely in some pain, so it's good. At least he said there's no hip pain anymore.

[00:06:40] He's got hip from, uh, pain from the surgery, but the hip pain is already gone. So that's good. Yeah. That's impressive. They've come a long way with, um, all of these medical miracles, Nick. So, uh, welcome to episode two 32 of the sounds like a search and rescue podcast. So this week we are, uh, this is, I guess Nick, this would be our, every once in a while, we have a bunch of stories and news that we have to do a catch up on. So this is our catch up day. Yes. It's a catch up episode. It's just me and Mike tonight.

[00:07:08] So if you like the guests better than us, then you probably want to tune out right now, but it's just going to be us tonight. Right. And we've had some great guests recently. Shout out to Dan last week. He was a great, great, uh, we, we, we covered a lot of Adirondack stuff. So I think that our Adirondack New York people will be happy with that episode. Yes. We appeased that, uh, that side of the fan club. We did. All right. So this week we're catching up on search and rescue news. We're going to catch up on recent hikes and we're going to also get back to notable hikes, plus a fatality on the Kinsmans. We'll talk about that.

[00:07:38] We've got the Pemi slash Liberty Springs problematic black bear has been removed. We've got some early season fires in the white mountains. We've got a recent hikes that we're going to cover on the bell naps, Mount Greylock, Moosalock, Bald Peak and the Kinsmans. Uh, plus we've got a little, we have a little politics here, Nick. We're going to do what the federal government is moving the forest service headquarters out of Washington, D.C. So we're going to talk about that a little bit. And then we've got a little bit of history.

[00:08:06] I've been reading up on, uh, some search and rescue events from the 1800. So we'll get into that. I'm Mike. And I'm Nick. Let's get started. Let's get started. And, uh, Nick, we can get started with, uh, giving a shout out to our friends at the Alzheimer's Association 48 Peaks. Yes.

[00:08:35] Use your passion for hiking to end Alzheimer's. Join 400 plus hikers as they climb New Hampshire's 4,000 footers or create their own challenge to support the mission of the Alzheimer's Association. The annual hiker celebration will be Saturday, June 13th at Ledge Brewing with Raffles Food and an amazing community. Hike that weekend or any day you want this summer. No fundraising minimums. Those who raise $125 will receive the annual performance grade t-shirt and a ticket for the hiker celebration. Let's turn the white mountains purple to end alls. Visit alls.org slash 48 peaks to learn more.

[00:09:04] And if you'd like to join the slasher podcast, 48 peaks team will be hiking Mount Adams on June 13th and there'll be a, uh, link in the show notes here. Right. Yeah. We'll include the link in the show notes and I will be getting an email out, uh, probably I think early next week with it, with a team member. So if you signed up, uh, sit tight, we'll get you, uh, all the information and the planning for that June 13th event. And then there is a, I'll send a note out to everyone too.

[00:09:34] There is a deadline coming up in, I forget the exact date, but it's like an earlier to mid May that, uh, you need to re raise at least $125 if you want to receive the performance grade t-shirt. So that deadline's coming up on a couple of weeks. So we'll, we'll keep you updated on that. Yeah. We're like T minus a month and a half out, something like that. Right. Right. So actually when, when this, so when this is recorded, I'll have already sent the note out to the team members and that will probably be like one week away, I think from the deadline

[00:10:03] on the $125, uh, criteria to raise, to raise, to get your t-shirt. So yeah. Cool. Excellent. And then our friends from Reckless Brewing, Nick, what do we have to say about Reckless? For those who spend their days navigating the granite peaks and unpredictable weather of the White Mountains, the trail doesn't truly end at the parking lot. It ends at Reckless Brewing Company. Located in the heart of Bethlehem, Reckless serves as the unofficial headquarters for the tired, the muddy, and the bold.

[00:10:32] It's where the trail stories are swapped over a massive menu of mountain-sized meals and pints of craft beer brewed for the North country soul. When the hike is over and the gear is stowed, Reckless is where the adventure truly settles in. Reckless Brewing Company, the finish line for every white mountain trek. Very good. Looking forward to some, uh, Reckless brewing and some, I like their, I like their burgers, Nick, after hiking. Their burgers are fantastic. I like their, like the chicken sandwiches, like the fried chicken sandwich they have. Oh yeah. Yeah.

[00:11:02] Was it the Tennessee hot sandwich they have in one of those, I think? Yeah. It's very good. It's making me salivate already. It is. So, all right. Um, well we got Dave Schitt's we covered. We already covered. Stomp, Nick. Nick, I'm recovering from, I'm hung over. Oh, you're hung over from, oh, cause you were, cause you were down being a college kid this weekend. I think, weren't you? I was being a college kid. Yeah. And I was like, oh, I'm going to behave no big deal. And I actually did. I was pretty good on a Thursday night.

[00:11:31] We got in late and then Friday night was pretty mellow. Went out to dinner and then when, went home relatively early and then, uh, shit just fell off the rails on Saturday night. So, you know, I did, I, I spent the afternoons. I kind of got away from the, it was a mother's weekend. So I was like the third wheel dad, but, uh, I went to the baseball games, Elon university. They played, uh, you university of North Carolina, Wilmington, which is a pretty good team.

[00:12:00] And, uh, they, they got swept, but I went to all the games after the game. I went to my daughter. She was having like a, a party at her house. They call her house, the bungalow. Ooh. Yeah. Which was good. And then we, we went to, they call it a darty Nick. It's a day party at the Delta Epsilon fraternity, I think. So we went there and then. We used to just call it day drinking. Yeah. They call it a darty, uh, part of day party or whatever.

[00:12:28] So we call pre, we would call it, um, happy hour. Yes. Okay. Sorry. Not to throw you off. No, that's fine. That's fine. And then, yeah. And then it started raining and they had a tent, which is pretty good. These kids know how to do it, but we decided to go to a bar and then from there things just got ugly. It was a, uh, two, two for $5 Bud Lights. And then they had, there was this place called Paulie's.

[00:12:54] I don't know if any listeners know Paulie's in Elon, North Carolina, but this place was the diviest of dive bars and they had shots and it just got, uh, I went way, way, way outside my comfort zone. So you're still, still nursing the hangover two or three days later. That's when you know it's. I'm continuing to hydrate. That's solid. Well, I'm glad you had fun down there. It was like Frank, the tank down there, Nick. You didn't go streaking. Did you? I did not.

[00:13:24] I did not. I got to go back down there in three weeks of graduation. So maybe, maybe we'll see. There's still, there's still time. Well, I hope, uh, we have another story when you come back in three weeks. There may be video. There may be. Well, thank God. Oh boy. I'm logged out of the Instagram account for a slasher or I would have posted some stuff. That could be bad. And stop would be looking like, what is this? Yes, exactly. Anyway. Um, all right. So now, uh, back to, back to regular, regular scheduled content here.

[00:13:51] So Nick three season hikers are coming out of hibernation with the warmer temperatures and, and the snow, snowless trail. So I'm going to talk about like, I put, I put a little segment in here about swapping out my gear, but what's, uh, what's your thoughts about this? I feel like they're coming out a little early given the amount of search and rescue news we've been seeing. Yeah. That's what I was going to say. I mean, it, it, it sounds like we had a, um, listener and friend sort of reach out to us just about people being out. Um, seemingly woefully unprepared going up to Franconia Ridge.

[00:14:20] I know I, I crossed people on Moose Lock a few weeks ago and like sneakers and jeans going up, but I think some of those early warm temps we had, uh, kind of to kick things off in April, um, kind of made people think, especially if you're, if you're down here, that kind of the snow's melted and things. So it seems like it's, it's definitely triggered a little bit earlier. I know traditionally with your SAR news and kind of your graphs, April's usually kind of the end of the slower months and it picks up in May, but it seems like we're off to, um, things with a bang, unfortunately in April. So, and I think that early warm weather seems to be a stretch.

[00:14:48] And I mean, it's snowed in the white since, and it's going to probably snow a little bit. It looks like even into this weekend up high again. So, um, that snow and everything is not over yet, unless you want to like stay below probably 3,500, 4,000 feet. I think you're still going to see monorail in the woods, um, for probably a few weeks to come. Yeah. I'd stay away from the presidentials and the, you know, Franconia. I mean, the Moose Lock maybe be okay, but I, I, I wouldn't mess around too much with, with those high peaks.

[00:15:15] If you do, then just expect to pack for winter, I guess. Yeah. I mean, keep an eye on new England trail conditions. Um, their website's a good resource, Facebook, stuff like that. Um, I think you're, it's going to be very, a lot from trail to trail too, but definitely worth checking to see like what the conditions are, uh, even day to day. Um, before you kind of get out there, I don't think you're going to, we're going to get like a two or three foot snowstorm at this point in the game. Um, obviously, but the conditions can be kind of approximate to I'd say like November, December up high, um, this time of year.

[00:15:45] Right. Yeah. And I think we're getting, I think Thursday we're going to get another rainstorm. So yeah, keep an eye on the, the water, uh, crossing levels and all that stuff. I think that the, the East branch of the Pemi, the deal there is essentially it's, um, yeah, I think anything under 600 cubic feet per second reading is, is I think four to 600 is sort of like your, your risk zone. Anything under 400 is okay. Anything over 600 is a no go. So just keep that, that in mind.

[00:16:15] Uh, we'll put those, those graphs up for people that want to, want to check it out. So I forget what the, the gauge height is, but it looks like it's, yeah, I'm just looking at it right now here, actually. Young Nick, it looks like it's, it's still running pretty good on the East branch. So yeah, it spiked up a little bit and now it's, it's heading back down, but it's going to come back up again on Thursday. So I'd be careful. Yeah. Use caution, use caution out there.

[00:16:44] And if you want to dodge it altogether, just stay lower. I think if you're staying below 3000 feet, you're probably pretty much in the clear. Yep. Yeah. Osspies, Bell Naps, um, anything, uh, lower 52 with the views are good right now. So, um, all right, Nick, what else we got? No, we got, I, I just saw the safari hopped on. So this was kind of exciting, but main native Will Peterson, um, is attempting a self-supportive Appalachian trail fastest known time. So he just, uh, just kicked off things.

[00:17:11] I think today or yesterday, um, as of like April 28th, it is self-supported, self-supported, self-supported. Yeah. Which I thought was really interesting. Not that we're down on the, uh, supported, but kind of in light of our conversation with Cheswick we had not long ago, I thought the self-supported was kind of a cool thing. Okay. Wow. That's pretty good. Will's a beast. He's got, um, he's got the FKT for the Deritissima.

[00:17:38] He's got the bald face circle trail. He's got the FKT did that in two hours in the evening. That's insanity. Yeah. That's nuts. Some of these times are crazy. He's got the long trail, uh, supported FKT and it's impressive. He's got hot to hot. And what else? I thought he had the presidential traverse, but I guess not. Yeah. It looks like that one, um, he was swept out a little bit. Yeah.

[00:18:07] Well, an impressive specimen as my father-in-law would say for sure. Yeah. So that's exciting. Um, all right. So now we've got some New Hampshire news here. So I guess the first one here is, so our friend Andy had posted this on Facebook and then I think it got over to Reddit and it got onto some of the 4,000 footer group. So I haven't talked to Andy. I was going to text him, but I'll shoot him a note later. But, uh, so Andy from the cog, he had posted that, I think he had been up by Liberty Springs.

[00:18:35] He's either that, or he, maybe he knows somebody that, that is the caretaker over there or something, but it sounds like, uh, the, the fishing game department had to come in a dispatch or otherwise euthanize this, uh, this black bear that's been causing problems at Liberty Springs. Is that the way you're reading it too? I'm reading it that they must've, they must've euthanized the bear. Yeah, absolutely. And I'm on the same boat. I kind of wanted to reach out to Andy and kind of saw this stuff probably would have been good to do before now. Um, but yeah, what I was seeing, what I was seeing was, yeah, it sounds like it got, I

[00:19:05] don't know if it got into some sort of altercation with the campers or something happens, um, the previous evening and the, yeah, they finally had to euthanize the bear that has that notorious sort of penny bear. Of course there might be more than one penny bear is also the first thought that came to my mind. I feel like it's unlikely that it's just one bear. I feel like that's how they send to talk about it. But, um, now I think it's probably not totally out of, uh, out of the realm of possibility that there's a couple of bears that have become custom to kind of going near the Liberty Springs

[00:19:34] campsite and kind of looking for food. Um, and the other thing too, in light, cause I saw people getting confused with this on Reddit, the white mountain national forest did just announce that you need bear count bear canisters within the Pemi wilderness. Um, but that campsite isn't within the wilderness boundary. So you're outside, but at that point, you don't need a canister. It does sound like they have several bear boxes at Liberty Springs tent site. However, that doesn't mean that everybody's using the bear boxes all the time. So, um, I'm going to say that probably some people weren't or leaving food out in other places.

[00:20:04] Um, and it looked like Andy basically had pictures of it look like a bunch of trash and stuff ripped up. So it looked pretty fresh when it happened. I'm guessing maybe the hikers skedaddled. Um, maybe we'll get a little bit more updates as things go on. I looked on fish and games page and stuff and they didn't really have anything about it. So. Right. Seems like a lot of hearsay. Yeah. Yeah. It's tough to know, but, um, I think that this, so the evolution, this bear, this bear issue has been going on for probably since early, early, uh, last hiking season.

[00:20:31] So I think the first time I heard about this was somebody on the Bond cliff trail had got stalked by the bear. And then I think the, the, what I had read on in that case is that the bear knew the, uh, or, or associated food with the backpack. And I think that in that case, the hiker did give up the backpack and took off. So, uh, my theory was that, that that particular bear down there may have been, uh, picking up

[00:20:57] food from backpacks that were left at the bottom of Owl's head for, um, slide.

[00:21:28] Um, because I do think that that happens more than people realize. So I don't know, like you said, if it's two different bears or if it's the same bear or what the story is. Yeah. I don't know. Like I, I know even Forrest was mentioning Steve, uh, Smith being kind of walked out by one. I know Stomp mentioned he thought on the Pemi loop that a bear was following him for a bit. Um, it seems kind of odd to me that I'm, again, I don't know the range that bears standardly have. Um, but it seems likely that there's probably more than one. And I did want to pull, I forgot to throw in the script.

[00:21:56] I had the tab up, but just to give people an idea too, of how good bears are at smelling food, they can detect food over 20 miles away. So that's how good their sense of smell is. If they smell something, um, their sense of smell is seven times stronger than that of a bloodhound. So they have a incredibly good, incredibly keen sense of smell. Um, so if you have open food up and it's something that has, I guess, a strong scent or like peanut butter or something like that, they can probably smell that. Like you think 20 miles in the whites, like that's well, that's like easily from there you

[00:22:26] go, Lincoln Woods trailhead to probably the other side of the Pemi almost, they can smell food. So that's kind of crazy if the, uh, to think about. So. Right. Right. We'll have to, um, in fact, we'll have to text Dave and get his take on it. But my take is that, yeah, you're going to link Liberty Springs has bear boxes. Um, you know, it's a spread out campsite. I don't know what the other campsites are like on the Appalachian trail, but I, I do wonder

[00:22:51] if there's like through hikers that have just gotten kind of so used to sleeping with their food and they have no incidents in other areas. I know that in the Smokies, they have cables that are set up where you, they want everyone to hang the food. They don't, they don't use bear vaults. They use these cable systems, but otherwise I wonder if through hikers just get sort of comfortable sleeping with their food and they don't really use those, those bear boxes that are at the campsites on the AT parts of New Hampshire and Maine.

[00:23:18] And then, yeah, if a bear happened to be accustomed to associating tents or backpacks with, with food, then yeah, you're going to have these incidents like we saw at Liberty Springs. It doesn't seem to make sense that they would consistently come back to that campsite that has bear boxes. If there was, they weren't smelling some food or at least a strong scent of food there. Yeah. A hundred percent. It's interesting to me, like you said, Mike, I think that red article was kind of alluding to that fact that a lot of AT hikers are just used to sleeping with their food.

[00:23:47] And again, we can get Dave's take on that. But it is interesting. You think of the entire AT, like not to have issues to make it to the whites where you're still good with that. And all of a sudden the whites, the black bears are kind of doing that. Like, I don't know if it's just happenstance by them getting food and they kind of get the knowledge, like you said, to look for backpacks and stuff. But it's, it's kind of odd to me that like, you think it would be other areas of the AT, like it'd be a persistent issue, I guess is what I'm trying to say. It's not, it wouldn't just be a thing in the whites. Yeah. I don't know. Like I said, like, I think that it's probably not the AT through hikers.

[00:24:15] I suspect that that owl's head slide situation out there is probably where the bear discovered like, oh, backpacks got food in them. Or that maybe people will leave them backpacks elsewhere. Who knows? I mean, they're smart too. So it's one instance of that. They're going to remember it. Right. Right. So, but yeah, so now the rule is of course, like if you're, I think that people should just sort of get used to, get a bear vault, the bear canisters, get used to using them. They're really not that. I mean, it's a little extra weight.

[00:24:44] It does suck on a, I'm a weekend backpacker myself. So it's easy for me to say it. I get it. If you're doing like a long through hike, it's a different situation. But I do think that just getting used to the bear vault and the, the storing the food is, it's a lot easier than dealing with a hang too, from my perspective. Yeah. And I mean, I don't want to sound too hypocritical because I'm generally a day hiker too. And when I've camped, it's been kind of at actual campgrounds or places where you have bear boxes. I haven't had to deal with kind of storing that myself. So. Right.

[00:25:11] So anyway, the Pemi beer is no longer around. So we'll see. Maybe we won't have any issues. I guess, Nick, you will find out if there continues to be issues, then you know it was more than one beer. It'll, it reminds me of kind of Jaws where they think like they got the shark and then stuff keeps happening. They're like, oh, we didn't get the shark. And they're like downplaying it. That's true. That is true. We'll see. Rest in peace. Next up, Nick here. So I think we had, I don't even know if we covered this one.

[00:25:41] Maybe we covered it last, last episode as a missing hiker, but this is a, this one kind of is weird. It must be weird for you, Nick, because you were like so close to that area. Yeah. It was a little strange. Yeah. But there was a hiker fatality on Tuesday, April 21st. So this was, I think the guy went out camping like two, three days ahead of time. He was from West Roxbury. You don't know my name, Kent Wood, 61 years old. He was out of, he was hiking out of Lafayette campground.

[00:26:07] And then he went up into the Kinsman's area, but you were hiking, you were solo hiking on that Monday. You came up the other direction, Nick, but what, what are your thoughts here? I don't know. It was, it was kind of eerie hearing about it the next day. Cause I was probably, I know they'd set a remote section of the Kinsman pond trail, but I probably was within a few miles of where he was. Um, that section doesn't get traveled as much this time of year for sure. Um, but yeah, it's unfortunate situation.

[00:26:35] I mean, it was full mess spring shoulder conditions up there. I mean, it had snowed five or six inches, um, Sunday into Monday and was snowing pretty good while it was up there for a bit. Um, and it, yeah, it sounds like he left on the Friday, um, after his significant other hadn't heard from him for a couple of days, she kind of called it in. Um, and yeah, they, they basically, uh, they found him in the Kinsman pond trail, five and a half miles from his car deceased. So really sad situation. Yeah.

[00:27:05] Yeah, it is. Uh, nobody really knows what the, what the story is as far as whether this was a hypothermia, whether this was a medical issue or, or what the deal is. I think that there was some reference to, um, I'm trying to think. So essentially he started hiking on Saturday, April 18th with warm temperatures and clear skies. Last contact he had with the family was his family was on Saturday afternoon. They didn't hear from him for two days.

[00:27:33] So the family became concerned and called fishing game. And, um, the, the press release here basically says that Woods was prepared for warmer conditions and not those three to five inches of snow. So that's just reading between the lines there next, maybe that he didn't realize what he was in for as far as cold weather goes. Yeah. I mean, it was tough. I think there was a really dramatic shift. Um, there was down here, but similar in the whites where I think it was might even been

[00:28:01] in like the high fifties, mid fifties, a lot of those summits around 4,000 feet on Saturday. And then by Monday, I mean, it was like probably in the teens. So like low twenties on top of the Kinsmans with snow. So pretty dramatic shift there. And, uh, maybe like you said, reading between the lines, just not expecting it. And one thing too, is if it's wet and snowy like that, and then you get cold, it's kind of a really tough situation if you don't have dry clothing to change into and things. And we can kind of only speculate what happens. Yeah. It's tough.

[00:28:31] The, um, and it's the Kinsman pond trail. I don't think I've been, I haven't gone up that way, Nick. We're going to talk about going up like ball peak in the backside. Uh, but I've always gone up like lonesome lake and fish and Jimmy. I haven't really gone down that other way. Yeah, no, I kind of was looking up a little bit about it. I've gone at least past like sea Kinsman pond and stuff where like the campground is, but I've never gone first in that. Um, but it sounds like there's a couple of cascades along it, um, and whatnot sort of leaves from the basin parking area or the opposite side of, uh, the base, I guess, depends

[00:28:59] on which side of 93 you park on, but leaves right around that area. Yeah. Yeah. Condolences to the family. Um, one of the, one of the friends, you know, you get on these social media sites and people are critical and comment about what could have been, should have been, whatever we do. I mean, obviously look, we do a little bit of that too, but, um, try to be respectful. And one of the, one of his friends, a family friend had written that, uh, you know, he was a great person that everybody loved him, great sense of humor, and they were going to miss him terribly.

[00:29:29] So yeah. Condolences to the family. 61 years old. I mean, that's, that's still a lot of good living left. Uh, so sad to hear and pass. Yeah. A hundred percent. It's, it's unfortunate when you see like some Monday morning quarterbacking in situations like this and it's, it's someone's family member. Um, he'll be missed and yeah, we hope the family can find some peace eventually. Right. Right. Um, all right. And then next, next topic here, Nick, it was sticking with New Hampshire things. We've got a couple of different New Hampshire topics.

[00:29:59] Yeah. Um, so this next one is, there was a little bit of a brush fire, I guess you'd call it. I wouldn't call it a forest fire, but, uh, brush fire in Hart's location. So what's, what's this all about? So this one, I ended up looking up because our buddy Steve, uh, was up there this weekend and had posted either a video or a story, but I happened to see with smoke coming off like near Frankenstein Cliffs. It looked like, and I kind of was messaging him and he's like, oh yeah, it looks like there was some brush fires and ended up looking up on WMUR today.

[00:30:26] And it sounds like there was like three different brush fires kind of all along the tracks, um, kind of over the weekend, the twin mountain fire crews were battling them. Um, not really sure what the cause was. They kind of didn't mention it. It sounds like there might've been some speculation. I know, I know Mike, you might've heard a little bit about potential causes and people too. Yeah. A couple of people had said that they thought that like maybe the, uh, Conway scenic was, um, up there and, you know, I don't know how this works. I have no idea.

[00:30:54] And then another thing I could text Andy about to probably get a little bit of perspective, but somebody was saying like maybe sparks had, um, impact, or sparks had gone off from the train and started the, who knows, but, uh, either way, like something was going on up there by Frankenstein cliff in that area. Yeah. And, um, just to, for, uh, the people that aren't familiar, Hart's Location is actually sort of the town that I guess makes up where Crawford Notch is. If you think about like the top of Crawford Notch, um, driving down until you get to Bartlett, it's sort of that whole area.

[00:31:24] Not a lot of people really living in Hart's location. Um, but that sort of area when we referenced it. Um, and I did, uh, kind of go down a little bit of a rabbit hole here. Um, just because we've had some droughts in the whites recently, I'm kind of looking at just the winter and some stats. Um, so the white mountain, cause it, it actually called us out in the, um, video too, which got me down this path, but the white mountains are still in a drought as of, uh, the spring of this year in 2026. Um, most of New Hampshire remains in a moderate, moderate drought or abnormal dryness.

[00:31:54] Um, that I kind of went through digging cause I know that we had a pretty good winter in terms of snowfall in the whites this year. Um, so this winter in the whites, there was slightly above average snowfall. Um, I kind of too, I was curious how this affects droughts and things like that, but, um, and mentioned that it didn't actually fully fix this drought because the snow pack, a lot of it had low water content and the melt didn't actually fully sink in because there was a couple of stretches this year where everything was so frozen that it doesn't actually absorb into the ground.

[00:32:22] So it kind of just runs off and doesn't actually absorb into the terrain where it's falling. Uh, so a little bit of a breakdown for snow totals this year. So mountain Washington, um, which gets the most snow in New Hampshire, probably not surprising since it's the tallest, um, gets, it got around 215 inches. It's average is around 280. So Washington had quite a bit below average snowfall. I know in November they almost broke the record for a month, but that's not calendar winter. So it doesn't really count, um, around base of communities.

[00:32:51] So like downtown Lincoln, Woodstock, Gorham, things like that. Um, they averaged around 80 inches to 120 inches versus the average of 90 to 120. So a little bit above there from what they normally get. And then up in the mountains where we're all hiking kind of those elevations between 2,500 14,500 feet is actually where the bulk, um, and where it was a bit above average this year. So 140 to 190 inches of snow. Um, and the average is 120 to 180. So definitely higher on the average side there.

[00:33:20] Um, and started to look a little bit in terms of recovery from a drought and what that kind of looks like in the whites. Um, it's going to take a lot of rain, um, believe, uh, 10 inches consistently over sort of whatever next amount of time for the whites to actually tend to catch up. I'd actually mentioned that the rain really is the most important factor in terms of droughts in the whites that actually people think the snowpack sort of supplies everything all year, but because the snowpack doesn't linger all year in the whites, it is mostly rain that tends to fix droughts.

[00:33:50] Um, and it sounds like there is a kind of good forecast, at least looking at a spring, the whites is getting, uh, are getting rain this weekend. Um, it'll be already happened by the time this comes out. Um, but some kind of things that come with droughts are obviously elevated wildfire risk. Um, and you also got lower stream and waterfall levels sometimes, which can make crossings a little bit easier. Um, but also makes waterfalls less spectacular.

[00:34:14] So was it last year that we had that, um, streak of 13 weeks of, of rainy weather every weekend? Yeah. I'm trying to think of those last year or two years ago at this point. It was like, I think it was last year. There was something crazy that the Adirondacks was like even worse, but then it was like, it was really dry through the fall. Right. Last year. I remember like people's wells were running dry and stuff, but. Yeah. It was, it was 13 weekends in a row of rainy weather. And then I think it just stopped and got just completely dry.

[00:34:44] Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, it affects foliage and things like that too, where if, if we don't get a lot of rain kind of late summer, it can make foliage less dull. So hopefully as much as nobody likes to see rain, you want to be out hiking, but the whites are in need and really greater New Hampshire as a whole is kind of in need of rain. It's funny down here from that snow we got, I was looking at the, the Noah drought map, like Southeastern mass. And like, even like where you are North shore, cause we got that, a lot of the snow over the years, like we're kind of good to go, but New Hampshire didn't really get like a big blizzard this year.

[00:35:12] They got a lot of sort of moderate snow storms and consistent snowfall, but nothing really huge. Well, hopefully we'll get a little bit of rain. Hopefully it'll be on Mondays and Tuesdays, Nick. Yes. All right. So that is it for the, uh, the brush fires. And then, uh, I've got a local story here, fresh off the, uh, fresh from the news here. So I pay a lot of attention to rest area situations here, Nick.

[00:35:38] So there has been an ongoing request for proposal request for quotes from the state of New Hampshire for the Hampton beach, uh, interstate 95 liquor store property. So there's two rest areas on 95, right over the, uh, the Massachusetts border and in Hampton, New Hampshire that are currently liquor stores, but they're, they're very big footprints.

[00:36:01] So, uh, they're, they're putting out a bid to have companies that are willing to build out the rest areas so that they're larger. So there was two companies that made the finals. One was called global partners. Um, that sounds very like an evil corporation, Nick. We wouldn't want them. It does. Global partners. Yeah, exactly. It sounds like they're up to no good. And then, um, our favorite and our, our, we're rooting for the common man roadside.

[00:36:31] Yes. The two finalists, right? So I don't even understand why they need two finalists. They should have just basically said to the common man, we have an opportunity for you and just like work with them to, to make it happen. I'll defer to the, we, we, I pulled like a news article on this probably a couple months back now, but it was saying how much revenue the common man and the rest areas have raked in for the state of New Hampshire. Like it's a pretty good amount. Yeah. So, uh, those breakfast sandwiches are not cheap. No, they're not. They're not. Uh, neither are the chips and everything else that I buy from there. And I just throw, throw away my money.

[00:37:01] Those pretzels, they carry everything, every cider donuts. Oh my gosh. Cider donuts. I got some of the cabinet right now. I don't know how safe it is to have a common man within like a five minute drive to my house, Nick. Oh, that's true. You'd be close. You'll just be like making runs out to get breakfast sandwiches in the morning. I'll be back. Can't be good. It can't be good. But anyway, there's all kinds of drama going on. So they put a bid out for this thing, these things. I don't know, Nick, if you understand how this bid, this is business stuff. So pay attention. All right.

[00:37:29] The state will put out a request for proposal and they'll say like, we want you to, um, provide us with a summary of your solution for how you would build out this area. And then these businesses put together for a proposal and the common man put theirs in and this evil global partners and company put theirs in. So now, um, they, they have a committee that then will look at these proposals and make a decision. The problem that we've got with this situation now is that there's been an ethics complaint

[00:37:57] filed against a state official alleging that they attempted to influence the outcome of the bidding process to lease and develop New Hampshire's interstate 95 liquor store properties. Look, if they were trying to influence this to make sure that the common man got picked, then I would have no issue. But the problem is, is that this guy's clearly in the tank with global partners. And, uh, apparently the, and the guy that's saving everything is the Hampton area chamber of commerce president.

[00:38:27] So he's the good guy. John Nyhan filed a complaint on April 22nd with the executive branch ethics committee against state consumer advocate, Donald Christ, who publicly endorsed global partners over comments. So Donald Christ is the bad guy in this story. In case you're not following along, he wants global partners, which global, they're probably going to put in a Burger King and a Dunkin' Donuts in that place. It's ridiculous. This is like some of his quotes in here are very, very harsh.

[00:38:56] I love it. He called the common man's roadside existing locations clownish in a parody of New Hampshire's architecture. Usually, look, I keep it PG-13, but this guy's an asshole. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, he, like even this, he's talking about efficiency. Like, I mean, again, like we're, I will freely admit I am biased towards those roadside areas, especially being a Massachusetts resident that regularly drives up off hours. But that place is always clean. There's always bathrooms available.

[00:39:24] Typically, no matter how busy it is, you can get food in there. Like no matter what time, I think I've walked in there before 4am before even and got stuff and you can get service and buy things like they run things pretty well from what I can tell. Again, I can't see their books and stuff, but if they're making a lot of money for the state of New Hampshire and they're being efficient doing it, like I don't know. I don't know what efficient is. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is outrageous. This guy crisis. He's terrible, terrible.

[00:39:53] So I guess he was appointed to this executive council and he's voting for global partners, but his timing was terrible. So now, since this has happened, the state of New Hampshire has now put out a notification that, so this conflict of interest thing or the ethics violation happened on April 22nd. Just today, the state has put out a notice saying that they are restarting the entire process again.

[00:40:22] So I don't know what's going on here. Yeah. Something fishy must have happened then. Yeah. Yeah. So, but like this, the, the chamber of commerce from Hampton, he's correct. Such public hostility towards a state vendors unbecoming of an executive branch official. Yeah. I'm surprised that again, they're making a lot of money for the state at those rest areas and running them. Um, so I, I don't know. It's an interesting take that the state didn't come out and say anything about it. And then they just pulled, I mean, they pulled, I guess they pulled it and they're going to restart the whole process.

[00:40:51] So that says something, but I don't know. It's odd. Yeah. Yeah. I guess this global partners is a, is a Manchester developer. So, okay. Um, he's the owner of Revo Casino and a long time figure in New Hampshire development. And he's credited with revitalizing downtown Manchester in the mill yard. So, okay. I guess global partners isn't as bad, but common man is what this podcast is a supporter of common man roadside, Nick. Yes.

[00:41:21] We didn't talk about it, but we agree. So yeah, we want more common man. In case you didn't get that vibe already. Yeah. Yeah. So I really swear or get upset, but this is outrageous. Fire it up. Yes. Fire it up, Mike. You gotta calm down. Yes. Okay. Um, so that, that's the story. They'll put the link in the show notes. Are you ready for Slasher's Beer Review?

[00:41:55] Nick, this next, this next segment, I had put together a list of gear. I have some gear swap outs that I have for my, my gear right now. So I thought I would just run, run down that list, but I didn't know if you, do you have a viewpoint on this? Um, not really. Uh, I, I tend to use the same backpack, uh, for all seasons. I've kind of always carried like a 30. I think my old one was a 33. I've got a 35 liter, um, hyper light now.

[00:42:23] Um, so I tend to use the same one unless I'm going on like an overnight trip. I don't carry, I know you carry the 55 most of the winter it seems like, but so I don't swap out, I swap out my gear and stuff, but my pack kind of stays the same for the most part. Okay. Well, that's it. In case listeners are curious, here's, here's my system. Um, so I've got the 55 liter hyper light that I use for the winter. I put that away. That's, that's now used for backpacking over the summer. I've got a 25 liter, uh, ultimate direction fast pack that I use. So everything goes in there.

[00:42:53] Traction is gone. I will bring rock spikes and whatnot, but again, I'm not going, this assumes I'm not going into the presidentials or Franconia or anything like that. If I am, then I'm going to bring more winter gear right now, given the conditions. But, um, as I swap out into my three season stuff, this is what I'm talking about. So traction is mostly gone. I got a pair of rock spikes in the bottom of the pack if I need them, uh, outer gear. Basically I keep the shell and then I will swap out my heavy puff for like this mid-weight Patagonia that I have that has no hood on it.

[00:43:22] So, um, and then, cause I have a hood from the shell if I need it. And then I will just put in one pair, one hat and one pair of mid-weight gloves that stay in the pack. Now the goggles, the balaclava, that all goes into the store. And then on the clothing side, I get rid of the heavy soft shell pants. I'll go with my lighter hiking pants or shorts. Nick, Nick is basically full shorts at this point. And then hiking poles will stay. I'll add an umbrella if needed.

[00:43:51] And then my boots are gone and I'll replace those with a trail runner. And then I put it in a water filter and I, but the newest addition I have, Nick, is the, the hand loppers. I keep those in the backpack all times and then a silky saw and then a big, big loppers if I'm going out to do bald face trail maintenance. You're keeping your hand thing in, uh, all times in your pack? I keep my hand loppers in there. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Cool. Just in case you need to do an impromptu trimming. Right. Exactly. Okay. I like it.

[00:44:21] Otherwise I'll forget if I, if I don't keep them in there, I'll forget to bring them and then I'll be sad. Well, yeah, I think I'm mostly in the same ballpark. I do like an in-between where I did it on moose lock, but sometimes I'll wear leggings, like smart wool leggings and shorts over them before I go full shorts. Cause I just, I get warm. Usually if it's warm enough, uh, for me not to wear soft shell pants, I'm kind of wearing shorts, but I have gone the in-between a little bit this year, but I'm kind of in the same ballpark. Like you said, if you're going to above tree line, it's hard for me not to bring a shell

[00:44:49] with me whenever I go in the presidentials, unless I know it's going to be like 80 degrees and it's like June or July, but I'm pretty much doing the similar, similar thing. Right. And then you get bug spray and sunscreen here too. That's a good point. Yeah. Yeah. Um, kind of always, I always forget to bring those like the day we did the bell naps, even I definitely had some sunburn on my face. I just don't think about it when it's like 25, 30 degrees out still, you know, but this time of year, the sun's like even more strong, I think than say like August kind of September timeframe.

[00:45:17] So you definitely can get burned even though the temperatures are still a little chilly. True. True. Um, yeah. And that's, that's basically it. I mean, that was also the time of the year where if you're going to treat your clothes, socks, shoes with permethrin for ticks, this would be the time of the year to do it. Cool. And I was going to add, since this kind of will just be our gear review segment. Um, I did, uh, I did have one kind of follow up with my, uh, my comment on last episode, which is that Topo Athletic didn't have wide shoes. It turns out I'm just a moron.

[00:45:46] Um, and I just need to click on a different colorway. So they very much have wide shoes at Topo Athletic. Um, and their customer service rep was kind enough to email me back. Um, I do find most websites when you're shopping for shoes, usually if you need wide shoes, they'll say wide at the top and then you select wide and then it narrows it down to the colorways that are available. But their website in my defense is the opposite where you have to click each colorway to see if wide is available. Um, so it turns out they have a good fit and now I'm kind of going to be between whether

[00:46:14] I want to keep the speed goats or keep the Topo Traverses that I checked out and ended up buying. So, um, didn't want to follow up with that, but I have no other real gear updates. All right. Well, we'll, uh, I'm looking forward to just having no boots and trail runners and a light pack. I enjoyed that when we did the bell naps. Yes, that was quite lovely. Excellent. All right. So this next one, this is a national story, a little bit political here.

[00:46:39] So we'll, uh, we'll tread lightly here, but, um, this, somebody had, I forget, a couple of people had reached out about this and had mentioned it in comments or had asked for our perspective. So the Forest Service is moving the headquarters from Washington DC to Salt Lake City, Utah. So, um, the USDA is prioritizing forest management, um, and moving the Forest Service headquarters to Salt Lake City.

[00:47:08] They basically are saying that this is a common sense move. They want to put the, uh, Forest Service closer to the forest that they manage in 90% of the forest system that they, that they manage is in the, is west of the Mississippi. So, uh, they felt like moving the headquarters out of DC and into Salt Lake City would be the best, uh, move for the future of the U.S. Forest Service.

[00:47:31] So there is a reorganization update page on the government website that covers a little bit of detail here, Nick. So as part of the USDA reorganization plan, the Forest Service is realigning its organizational structure to strengthen local leadership, streamline operations, and improve mission delivery. So this includes moving headquarters to Salt Lake City, transitioning to a state-based leadership

[00:47:57] model, building a network of operations service centers, and unifying the agency's research program. So I think the research program, Nick, is where the big controversy is because, um, they're shutting down like a large volume of research locations. My read on this is that there's a, well, the government's claiming that they're going to centralize them and make them a little bit bigger. But what goes along with that is that there's a high volume of, uh, research facilities that are going to, uh, to close.

[00:48:26] The Forest Service claims that the RE-ORG will not eliminate scientific positions, cancel research programs, or reduce the national research footprint. In many locations, closer refers only to individual buildings currently housing. Small teams and staff and programs will continue their work, relocating into fewer facilities while maintaining research presence across the country. So who knows? Can you trust the government? Probably not. Yeah.

[00:48:54] I mean, my, my one take with, uh, this that I'll say just from watching how it is in our community and the whites, and even around here in Massachusetts, is that a lot of the trail maintenance and things like that, when you're looking out on the ground, like we're both trail maintainers, a lot of it's through the AMC where we are in the states and things like that. So, um, in the way, at least I'll say the white specifically, I don't have as much insight into what the Forest Service is doing. I know that they run a lot of programs and I've dealt with them directly myself that way, like in trainings and things like that.

[00:49:21] Um, but there's a lot that local people do to maintain the trails and take care of those things. Right. Um, well, but I do think, I do wonder about a West though, Nick, that it's probably logistically, it's not as easy. A hundred percent. I was just about to say is that we're a lot smaller than say like, um, Colorado and the amount of forest land that they have, like in the rock Rocky mountain national forest or things like that. Um, the whites are much, much smaller. Right. Right. And the, uh, interestingly, the, I, I don't know the government, the, the governors like

[00:49:51] political, I'm assuming that you've got a Republican governor in Utah and a Democrat governor in Colorado. That's my guess. But both of those governors were supportive and happy about the news. So I think the Western States are happy to get more jobs and more recognition out there. Um, but I'm just trying to see what else is here. So there was some news articles indicating that, um, this was going to require thousands of employees to relocate.

[00:50:16] The forest services claiming they've got approximately 30,000 employees and only about 500 are expected to need to relocate. And these will mostly be people from the Washington DC office. Employees whose positions are relocated will receive information about their options. Um, and mostly it will be either Salt Lake City or Fort Collins, Colorado. Nick, if you're living in DC and somebody knocks on your door and says, you've got to relocate

[00:50:44] to Salt Lake City or Fort Collins, are you going to be upset? I mean, I, I wouldn't be probably, but. I'd be like, ah, okay. Sounds good to me. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, again, we're not, we're, we'll keep it lightly treading here, but it seems pretty specific that it was designed to shift, um, positions from Washington DC out to sort of the West coast. I feel like on paper, it's hard to argue with the fact that 90% of the lands they manage are out West. So, um, that's kind of tough to argue with from a logistical standpoint.

[00:51:13] Um, whether they need to be physically located there, probably a different thing. It depends on their job, but that's over my pay grade. Right. And I think rightly so people are distrustful of the government and, um, and the government doesn't do themselves any favors by acting trustworthy, uh, regardless of who's in charge. So I get it. It's always good. It's always good when you have an FAQ page linked with a bunch of myths and things dispelling what people might be, uh, thinking or insinuating that that's always a trustworthy take on things. Exactly. Get out in front.

[00:51:42] You might be thinking, you might be thinking this is bad, but it's not. Exactly. And then I think that, um, outside magazine, they did. So just to go back to the relook. So the big, the big ticket items here is they're going to close nine regional offices and establish 15 state offices. Um, so that's, I think that those states that are getting those offices are happy with it. Uh, they're relocating two thirds of the DC, DC staff to Western US. That's about 500 people.

[00:52:12] And then this is the big one. They're shuttering 57 research stations and consolidating others into a hub in Fort Collins, Colorado. So again, Colorado governor is happy about this. The, um, Utah governor is happy about this. People are concerned about these research stations for services saying like, yeah, they're just small spots and we'll move them into other bigger locations. But people are like, yeah, we don't trust it.

[00:52:37] So, but outside magazine did an article on this move and they basically broke it down into the two arguments. The government saying this is about building a forest service that's nimble, efficient, effective, and closer to the forest and communities it serves. Uh, effective stewardship and active management are achieved on the ground where forest and communities are found, not behind a desk in the Capitol. Conservation groups and, uh, critics of the government, uh, like public employees for environmental

[00:53:05] responsibility, warn that closing specialized research stations, and they, they cite Alaska to Florida across the location cripples the agency's ability to understand local forest diversity and combat climate change. Sweeping changes could isolate groups and slap a one size fits all approach to the 193 million US forest service managed acres. So I don't know, Nick, we'll have to see how it goes, but, um, a lot, a lot of stuff going on in the government at this point.

[00:53:33] And, uh, this, this seems like a move that's not going to be easily unwound. I don't think. No, if they're relocating everybody, I mean, though they've been relocated in DC forever. So I guess you could undo that if you wanted to, but, um, yeah, it seems like it has potential to make kind of a mess of things. I won't argue with that. Yeah. So we'll see. I think that I was trying to read through and see if there was any local impact here, Nick, but like you said, like we've got a very strong volunteer, um, presence in the White Mountains.

[00:54:00] We've got like just, uh, there's a research facility, I think in Durham, and then there's a couple of Massachusetts and other locations that are probably going to shut down, but they're going to keep the one in Durham. So, um, I don't, I don't think it's going to have a, uh, an immediate direct impact, but if anybody knows more about this and wants to reach out to us, feel free to shoot us an email at slasherpodcast.gmail and we'll, we'll look into it. Yeah, for sure. All right, Nick, this is the part of the show where we do your music minute. All right.

[00:54:29] So I'm going back to more mainstream this week, uh, to, to appease you, but also to appease, uh, myself, I guess. Thank you. So I tried to pick, I went down the rabbit hole of some seventies and eighties stuff and I wasn't sure exactly what I wanted to pick. I think you might've said seventies in your last quote, but we want eighties. Um, so I got Surfer Rosa by the Pixies. This came out in 1988. So the Pixies, if you're not familiar with them, and I thought it was interesting too. I looked up and wasn't, wasn't, didn't realize this, I guess myself, but they always call

[00:54:59] themselves Pixies, not the Pixies, but everybody I've ever talked to calls them the Pixies. Right. That's what I would. Um, but, but Pixies were formed in Boston in 1986. So a local band and quickly became one of the most influential bands in alternative rock. Their lineup on Surfer Rosa featured Black Francis on vocals and guitar, Kim Deal on bass and vocals, Joey Santiago on lead guitar and David Lovering on drums. The group in that record helped define the band's signature sound raw, dynamic, and hugely influential

[00:55:28] on what alternative rock would become in the years that followed. So if you're from New England, it's pretty neat that the Pixies feel like a local band. So they came out of Boston and the music scene in the mid eighties. And, um, obviously they, they kind of became a nationally recognized band after that, but they did start over here. They're kind of like a, not as big as Aerosmith, but another local band. So that's always pretty neat. Their 1988 debut album, Surfer Rosa still sounds pretty wild. Even today. It's raw, a little messy in a good way. It's super unpredictable.

[00:55:58] So there's very loud, quiet shifts all over the album. Um, those dynamics kind of helped define it very strange lyrics, but I'd say very memorable lyrics as well. It's also got a very raw sounding stripped down production. Um, it almost makes it sound like a live album. I believe a lot of it, they did record live in the studio. Not so much kind of dubbing over tracks and whatnot, the drums and kind of constructing things, which is always neat. Tracks like Where's My Mind and Gigantic are standout singles, but the bigger story is on their influence.

[00:56:26] So bands like Nirvana took that loud, quiet dynamic and ran with it. And you can hear a direct line from this album to the whole grunge explosion in the early nineties. So even though this album was a massive commercial hit at the time, it ended up being one of the most important alternative rock albums and rock albums probably of all time. Um, certainly influential again through nineties, two thousands music. And, um, where's my mind? I wanted to call out individually. Um, cause whenever I hear this, I think of the end of the movie fight club that came out.

[00:56:55] So this is kind of the first time that I really heard this song and got familiar with the Pixies and then was like, Oh, they're a Boston band. I definitely need to check them out. Um, and again, this album and everything got exposed to a whole new group of people in the late nineties, even though it came out in the late eighties, the final scene, um, it suspect most people that are many people that, uh, listening to this, hopefully you've seen fight club. Um, but the final scene with buildings collapsing, everything unraveling and the song coming in,

[00:57:21] it's probably one of those like defining sort of cultural movie moments of the nineties. Um, introduced this album to a whole new audience that probably otherwise wouldn't have really sought it out at the time. Um, and it's cemented. Whereas my mind is more than a great track, um, kind of became a touch point tied to that whole era. So even now when people kind of hear that opening little guitar riff, um, they immediately think of that scene and it's one of the most iconic uses, probably a music and film in the nineties

[00:57:48] and debatably, I mean, over the past 30 or 40 years, I feel like that, that song is just so tied and cemented to the movie fight club and that end scene that it's tough not to, not to think about it when you listen to it. Yeah. I know, um, I definitely remember listening to them and I know where, where's my mind is like a, uh, it's sort of like he said, it's, it's the, it's the grunge before the grunge. And I think that like in the eighties and you don't probably remember this growing up,

[00:58:17] but there's like, there's always been, there was yuppie culture, which was sort of like the, uh, wall street, the movie wall street sort of talks about yuppie culture. And, uh, it was always focused on working and earning money and doing all this. But then like, there was this very, not only like grunge flip music overnight, but there was this sort of slacker culture that started developing a little bit before grunge. There was the movie slackers.

[00:58:44] And, um, I feel like this song was, is associated with that slacker culture. And as you go through life, like you see, you notice these patterns that go back and forth. And we've, we basically gone from a yuppie trend to a slacker trend back and forth over the course of like the, um, like I would say the slacker culture ended when the dot-com error began. Um, and then we've had, we had a long run with sort of the yuppie culture again from dot-coms up to the 2010s.

[00:59:12] And then the slacker culture came back in, I think more recently. And now we're probably pivoting again, I think with AI and all this other stuff back to more of a yuppie culture in the future. But, um, this song for whatever reason, just sort of like it, I associate it with slacker culture in the, the late eighties, early nineties, which, um, you know, so I, I listened to it a little bit earlier than the fight club piece of it, but yeah, I get, I, I know that scene too. And that like the beginning opening chords of that, that guitar riff are just incredible. Yeah.

[00:59:41] It's, it's definitely one of, um, I remember when I, um, was getting when magazines are more of a thing, but I get like guitar player magazines or ultimate guitar. I forget which one it was. And, uh, that like riff, even though it's like super simple, it was named, like, I think it was in like the top, like 20 or 30, like guitar riffs of all time. Just because you can hear it for like 30, like 13 seconds, 10 seconds. And you like know exactly what it's from and what song it is and everything. So it's not complicated, but it just shows that you don't need to make a complicated piece

[01:00:09] of music sometimes to kind of echo through generations of people. Like I think even most people like younger than me, absolutely know that song a lot of times just from that movie. So it's, it's pretty cool. Yeah. Good pick. Good pick young Nick. Thank you. Thank you. I get the pat on the back tonight. Very good. Very good. Not as angsty. Yeah, exactly. Um, all right. So if you want free stickers or in the slasher, you can get those at the mountain wanderer in Lincoln or spinners pizza parlor in Andover, mass. Uh, so go check them out.

[01:00:35] And if you want a slasher swag, you can check that out on our bonfire shop links in the show notes. If you want to donate to us, um, to show your support for the podcast, you can help, uh, help us out by sending a donation to slasher's buy me a coffee site. So donations help us pay for web hosting distribution and live events. And then if you want to do become a monthly supporter, you can check that box off. And then, um, it's basically impossible to delete it after that, but you can try if you want, but we'll appreciate it.

[01:01:03] Uh, but shout out to Alex M for five coffees, Nick. Yes. Thank you, Alex. We, we very much appreciate it. And, uh, we do have patches. So if any of you want patches, just reach out to us on social media, um, on Instagram, preferably, um, send us your address and stuff. Or if you just want to send us, uh, your Venmo and comment your address, uh, it's at slasher podcast. They're two 50 each. Um, they've been going pretty quickly. I've been, I've been keeping busy with the mail and stickers usually coming with them. So glad people like them and appreciating it.

[01:01:32] Better you than me, Nick. Better you than me. Yeah. That's why you wanted me to order that. I get it now. Hey, hold my beer. It's time to find out what Mike and Stomp are drinking on this week's beer talk. All right.

[01:02:00] So this is the part of the show where we talk about what beer we're drinking. I am, I'm hung over Nick. So I prepared already that I was not going to be drinking. So I'm just drinking water. Yeah. I'd got, um, I'm drinking athletic tonight. It's not your, your, your story was sort of the, the intro opening banter, I think for, uh, for this week, which, which was cool. Um, I was drinking some clouded judgment from reckless that I had one of our sponsors, delicious IPA that they have over the weekend. So very good. Yeah. I had a judgment on Saturday night. So I, I, I understand.

[01:02:31] Excellent. I knew we should have gone left back there. Stomp. Don't worry. I know it's this way. I've got a feeling in my gut. Uh, are you sure you're not about to have a, bowel emergency? Uh, totally. We got this. But I just blew out my hip. Fell down that gully with my 40 year old micro spikes. Suck it up, Stomp. It's 4 PM. We're at 3,500 feet.

[01:03:00] We got nine miles back to the parking lot. Your leg may be broken. We got no cell connection and we can't feel our fingers, but we're finishing all of my list tonight. By the way, I need some water. I'm empty. I would if I could see what I'm doing, but my headlamp batteries are dead. You gotta be kidding me. What a chump. This is the last time I hike with you. Psh, ha, whatever, mister. Do you know me? I have a podcast. Psh, whatever.

[01:03:28] Let's find out what Mike and Stomp have been hiking. Okay. This is the part of the show where we do recent hikes. So we've got a lot of catch up to do. Um, Nick, I'd say maybe let's start with your Greylock trip. So you did the, what did you do? The five, is it called the five summit loop? Is that what, is that what you officially did? Yeah. Something like that. Um, if you're coming from the side with the Haley farm trail head, uh, you start, start, start up in Western mass fashion and you start up to Mount prospect.

[01:03:55] Um, and then you head over to believe Williams, Fitch, Greylock. And then I ended up coming down towards Stony ledge, um, with that beautiful outlook of the hopper. Um, and yeah, this is, again, I feel like we, we keep talking sort of about recent hikes and we haven't dove into them. So I figured this would be a good episode to do it. Um, but on, in, at Mike's old stomping grounds, Greylock, Greylock's beautiful. I've only been, that's only my second time. I actually did it good Friday. Um, had a, had a half day, good reception in the Haley farm parking lot.

[01:04:23] Um, if you, you happen to be working or something like that, um, don't ask me how I found out, but, uh, it worked out pretty nicely. And, uh, yeah, fun day. It, it kind of was cloudy, rainy when I started and a little, uh, gnarly going up that side to the Mount prospect trail with it being wet and stuff. I think you had come down that way before, right? I came the opposite way. Yeah. So I came up, um, uh, Stony ledge and then, um, over by Sperry road. And then I came down, but yeah, the pictures you put, and sometimes these are the nicest

[01:04:53] days to go hiking. That was a moody day, right? Like low clouds and then you get some openings. So, yeah, it was, um, I started and, uh, kind of, I kind of picked Western mass on this day as opposed to New Hampshire, just because of how the rain was supposed to move through, but it was pretty night, pretty just cloudy in the morning. It did rain for like 45 minutes, pretty good when I was headed on Mount prospects. Um, but yeah, then stopped and kind of had this pseudo undercast, um, from gray lock. And it looked like you could see this sort of plateau across the way.

[01:05:19] I think it was like the who sick mountain range, maybe which are lingering around 2000 feet, which look kind of wild, just gazing across. And you had items below, you could kind of see, uh, some stuff through the clouds. Um, yeah, and it was nice. I mean, it was good temperatures. The trails were absolutely soaked and there was actually quite a bit of snow on the North side going from like Williams all the way to gray lock. There was still kind of monorail lingering on and off. I had my trail runners on, um, but it was pretty warm. So it wasn't too much of a problem, but just trails soaked, which probably isn't shocking

[01:05:49] this time of year. And I got to say out of that whole loop, that, that view from Stony ledge is probably my favorite view of that whole thing. It's cool looking around at that whole like ring in the hopper and stuff when you finished up. Right. And in a pretty legit day, like, I think everybody always thinks of the whites or like, you got to get maybe Adirondacks or whatever to get a big elevation day. Like that loop is like around 4,000 feet and like 13 and a half miles, I think, or something. So it's a pretty solid day. And it's generally, I mean, you got some little up and downs, but it's, it's mostly just going

[01:06:15] up to prospect and kind of, I don't know, a couple hundred feet between each up to gray lock and down. And really beautiful day. Yeah. I got to, I got to get up there for peak foliage. I feel like that just chilling out on Stony ledge right there for foliage would be sick. Yeah. We got to plan like a trip over there. Yeah. I want to camp on that Sperry road section there. So my, my cousin, a quick aside, my cousin, Sarah Beth actually camped up there with my other cousin, Mark, a couple of winters ago.

[01:06:43] And that like lean to that's up there and it like snowed like a foot and it wasn't supposed to overnight. So they're like, she's like, it's beautiful, but we had like the most miserable camping experience of our lives and that, and that lean too. Yeah. And the other thing too, Nick is, so listeners, Nick had like posted about wanting to check out some waterfalls and it's kind of like looking on the map here, like the loop that Nick did and the loop that I did, it's, and I don't know if you did the full five summits,

[01:07:08] but inside that circle from Mount Greylock, there are a bunch of like waterfalls that are on the map here and I don't know how good they are or what the story is, but they're all sort of, it's a long day when you, you know, I think it's like a 13, 14 mile loop if you do the full thing. But to go off to these little spur trails and hit the waterfalls is, is a little bit longer, but I want, I definitely want to do that. I think camping out may be, may be the way to do that and check out this March cataract falls and some other areas. Yeah.

[01:07:36] So, um, you know, I'll have to share, I probably shared it on the story when I had went, but I, I've just been in a state of flux with just taking a lot of photos and editing and whatever. But, um, you could see cataract falls actually across from stony ledge. Like you could see it pouring down the side of the hopper, which is pretty neat. Okay. Um, and it looked like it was in full force. I did not go see it, but as I was joking with you guys, the waterfalls were pretty much the entire trail up and down. And I, in the Haley farm trailhead also, that place is absolutely gorgeous just in itself.

[01:08:06] Even if you don't want to hike Greylock, just go there and walk around. It is absolutely beautiful. I feel like I'm like, am I trespassing? Should I even be here? You know what I mean? Like the trailhead's amazing. Oh, so in the morning, this was funny. I was walking along the trailhead and like something like, apparently there's cattle in one of the shed. There's like a really beautiful shed over there. It like moved super loudly and it scared the crap out of me. Like literally they like jumped a little bit. It was like, and I was like, oh my God, what's that? And I'm like, oh, it's just a cow. I'm okay.

[01:08:37] Yeah. No, it's an awesome area. So good, good work. Yeah. We got to get back to Greylock and you didn't go to Jack's hot dog stand. No, I didn't go to Jack's hot dog stand. I, again, driving up the other side, um, came back through this Taconic Valley, which I've never been through, which was also beautiful, but, uh, but yeah, no Jacks. Yeah. That's awesome there. We'll get there. Um, all right. So the next step, so me and you and our friend Jakester, uh, and we saw Julie or his wife, Julie in the parking lot. Uh, we did the, the bell nap. So we did, what, what is it? What would you call it?

[01:09:06] Like the, the Southern loop or the. Yeah. Like Eastern Southern loop. It's more Eastern than Southern, I think. But yeah, that like Eastern side, basically from like Clem all the way, uh, or Clem ran sort of that side all the way out to major. And we started on major and then looped around. Yeah. Anna, Matt, Clem. West quarry. Quarry, East quarry. Yeah. Um, yeah. So that was good. So I, I think Jake needed a bunch of those summits.

[01:09:33] So we had done the, the Western side, which I think that like, if you're going to do the bell naps, I mean, Mount Major is obviously spectacular, but I would say the better views overall would be that Western side where you've got bell nap and Piper and gun stock and a couple of those other ones. Like there's definitely more views. And I think it's more physically challenging. I think this side is more, after you get past major, you're in the woods and it's a lot

[01:09:58] of up and downs, nothing huge, like probably 300 foot climbs maybe to get up to. No, the only, the only challenge was keeping Mike from going left, leading ahead of us. True. True. I couldn't, I kept going the wrong way. So, which is good. We were talking a lot. Yeah. I went the wrong way like three or four times too. Yes. So. Yeah. It's a lot of, a lot of trail junctions on that side. There are, there are. But, uh, but anyway, so I needed one more, I think I needed a ran to finish up and then

[01:10:27] Jake needed like all of those summits and then he still had row to do. So, uh, we thought like, all right, if we do that big giant loop, it'll finish me up and then get Jake to the point where we've only got one more summit left. So, uh, we did, I don't even know what the mileage was. I can pull it up on Schrauber, I guess, as we're talking, but, but it was a long, long, long hike. Yeah. I think it was like 10, 10, 11 miles and just shy of 4,000 feet of gain, I think. Cause again, it's not like you get a good climb up to major, which is probably, I don't

[01:10:55] know if that's like 1400, 1500 feet kind of in the ballpark, but it's a lot of just like 200 foot down, 400 feet up, 300 feet down, 500 feet up kind of, kind of that deal as you're going across those peaks. Like I said, it just, every time, well, even though I went there when I've only been there twice, but when I went with Peter, it just reminded me, it's like, you're climbing up and down like the top three or 400 feet of watch you sit like over and over again. Right. So I've got 12 miles and 37, 3,800 feet of climbing. Yeah. There you go. It's not a, not a bad day for outside the whites. Nope.

[01:11:25] Not at all. Yeah. And there was like one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10 up and downs. Yeah. That's, that's a lot. I would say it beats up your legs in a different way too than if you're just doing like two or three up and downs across the day. Yeah. Yeah. It's a different mental, mental makeup too of it. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, I'm officially a finisher of the bell naps. I guess I got to put my, my patch in and then Jakester went in. We didn't have time.

[01:11:54] We ran out of time for him to, we were talking about maybe going to get row on its own. Cause it's really a small hike, but Jake got it the next day. So congratulations to him for finishing. And then you're just redlining at this point, Nick. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I've done it twice. I don't know. Maybe I'll go for the bell nap grid or something like that. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. People. I think there is a red line patch too, but it's a, it's a great little range and it was amazing to be in trail runners and like shorts. Oh yeah. It just was really nice. Yeah. Perfect place to hike March and April for sure.

[01:12:24] Yeah. Uh, and then Nick, you got out, uh, a bunch of other places here. So why don't you give you a rundown of, uh, where you've been? Yeah. I'll run through it. So, um, we had done that bell nap pike again, we're catching up so much. That was before the sort of the live, the mountain wanderer event. Um, but the next day I woke up and it was a beautiful day. And I, as my wife said, I can't help myself. Um, and I woke up early and did moose lock the next day. Um, I didn't need it for April, uh, keeping track of that, but mostly it was just close to where I was staying.

[01:12:53] The Woodstock and was kind enough to sort of let us stay over there for the night, which was fantastic. Um, and I was close proximity to the moose lock Gorgebrook trailhead. So I went up there, uh, like perfect spring condition, uh, type of day in terms of the trail. Uh, yeah, everything was pretty frozen up early on cause it had been cold overnight. Um, just solid snow. I'd say from like 2,500 feet on up from the Gorgebrook side, um, had that little bit of road walk, um, made my way up.

[01:13:22] Snow is starting to get mushy a little bit on the way down. Um, had the top completely to myself for like 20 minutes. I did cross some listener and friend Cecil on the trail. Um, met him up there, got some cool pictures of him. It was nice to kind of cross him. I definitely paid attention to him on Instagram and some of the pictures and stuff he shares and what he's out there doing. So it was neat. He said kind of good luck with the podcast and it's cool crossing him. Um, met a couple of people that recognize me from YouTube on the way down, which was odd because I've never had that happen before. Um, so that was kind of fun.

[01:13:50] Maybe I'll take video again, but a beautiful day and crossed our friend Fawn at the parking lot with her new dog. Oh, so chatting her up for a little bit before, uh, before we went down, but a really nice day. It was super clear, even though it was, it was kind of like hazy. I was looking back at pictures, but it was clear enough. You could see like all across Vermont, like Jay Peak and, um, Mount Mansfield and all that good stuff. So, um, that was a bunch of fun. That's awesome. Yeah. By the way, we had a bunch of listeners say hello on the bell naps too. I think we had like, um, three different groups or two or three different groups. So that was awesome too.

[01:14:20] So yeah, listeners get Nick there. They're recognizing us. We go to watch, we go to watch what we say. Yeah. Yeah. We gotta be careful. Yeah. Um, and then the following weekend I got up to the blue Hills, uh, with Rylan and then Ash and Ethan joined us for the first time. So it's Ethan's first trip to the blue Hills. There was something going on that day, like a, some sort of climate change initiative or something. So the normal parking lots were super full. We had to kind of start in a different location. Um, but we headed up top.

[01:14:49] We did sort of a, like, I don't know, four or five mile loop over great blue Hill and some of the stuff over there. The coolest thing over there that I've never checked out is they let you go. And I'm not sure if it was just this day, but we could go to the top of the weather reservatory over there. Um, so it was kind of neat. It was an interesting climb up through that little stone tower. I think we were both afraid that Rylan was going to like, just like tumble down the stairs. They were almost like those ladder type stairs. Like you see in like old, like I think of like the ships at battleship cove or something. Um, but beautiful views. Um, even though a little bit cloudy, kind of out to the city, um, and the surrounding

[01:15:17] areas, that was pretty neat and checked out some of the history stuff. They had guys playing guitar up there, which I felt bad for them and sympathetic because playing outside when it's like 45 degrees is kind of tough in terms of dexterity. Um, but we had, we had a fun day. Ash did a pretty well carrying Ethan. I had to give Rylan a piggyback for like half a mile. Um, she's getting really, really heavy, uh, to do it with uphill. Um, was regretting not having the backpack carrier with me for a little bit, but that was

[01:15:41] quick and then, um, had Patriots day off and, uh, snuck up and did bald peak in the Kinsmans. And, um, again, that was on April 20th. That was right before the day that, that, uh, that hiker unfortunately was found and recovered, but, um, a really nice day up there. Um, unfortunately there was some black ice on the way in the morning. So I was kind of driving slowly. I actually saw a car flipped on 93 South, I think around like the Plymouth area. So I kind of slowed things down a little bit there. Didn't want that to happen to me on the way up. Um, that would have kind of ruined the day.

[01:16:12] Um, bald peak, super gorgeous. Um, obviously a new 52 with a view peak. I'd been up there before had a low cloud ceiling. So, uh, that was a little bit of a bummer, but temperatures were pretty good. Um, then when I started to head up towards the Kinsmans, it was snowing a little bit. I'm like, Oh, this is kind of interesting. It's not supposed to snow anymore today. And then it was like dumping snow. Like it probably snowed four or five inches while it was up there. Um, ended up getting the Kinsmans for April and for spring. And it was a nice view.

[01:16:40] Um, albeit with a low cloud ceiling from North Kinsman on the way out, I sort of got a view from the ledge over there. And then I had a little view out to Cannon from that like Kinsman Ridge Trail junction where you hit, um, the Mount Kinsman Trail over there. And, uh, one thing I will gripe a little bit about the $20 parking just seems a little steep out of state to go park there to do it. I did pay it. So I don't know what to say. They got you, they, they got you over a barrel there, Nick. What are the alternatives? Where can you, where do, what are your other options?

[01:17:09] I mean, like real Brooker, like there's nothing. If you want to go up that side, I'd have to go up the fish and Jimmy side, which I do really love that side. Um, as opposed to the other side, it's a, like a lot more gradual way up. It was still kind of, it was treacherous coming down there, but like, I wouldn't have wanted to go down the fish and Jimmy trail with like sloppy snow. And I had like rock spikes on, but like they were balling up like every five to 10 minutes. It seemed like at one point I was like, just whack. I just had like a trek in Poland. And I just kept whacking the bottom of my heels. And, um, it was a mess.

[01:17:38] I did check out Kinsman flume, which was pretty neat, even though you can't see it, um, really well from one location, um, in the woods kind of off it's right near where bald peak splits off, which was neat. And, uh, there was a couple of cascades that were kind of flowing off the trail that I'd suspect are pretty seasonal. So that was nice. Well, but, uh, pay you 20 bucks, Nick, and, and, and enjoy your day. Yeah. That's what I mean. And I, I did enjoy him. It was 20 bucks. So yeah, I've spent $20 on the local organization. Yes.

[01:18:09] So very good. So yeah, you got out there, man. Yeah. Yeah. Three, three weeks at a time. I've been, I've been lucky and fortunate to get out and do some hiking. The weather's been conducive and worked out on the days I've been able to get up there. So I'm happy. And thank you, Ashley. Yeah. Yeah. You're the best. You're the best. I, um, I, I'm getting out. I think we're going on Saturday to put the internet up at the camp and then I'm probably going to go out on Sunday somewhere.

[01:18:31] So we'll figure it out, but it's time for Slasher's notable hike of the week. If you want to be considered for the hike of the week, simply tag Slasher on your social media post. Um, all right, Nick onto notable listener hikes of the week here. So we haven't done these in a while. So we've got some, some, um, tags to catch up on. Yes.

[01:19:00] Um, I went through like the past two or three weeks. I've just been building the list. Um, so yeah. Slasher notable hike of the week. Uh, you can just tag us on Instagram. No guarantees to be plugged on the show, but I do try to catch all of them. Uh, I'll freely admit. Um, so we got a ton of tags. I'm group. I am grouping these together, not individually for people getting their patches. Um, and I've been sending stickers with the patches. If you're really lucky, you get vintage PUDS podcast stickers and even geez, Louise hoop stickers and, uh, spruce spruce first stickers as well.

[01:19:30] So you get quite a variety. If you wanted all this, all the stickers, you can get them. Um, and again, just reach out if you do want patches. So thank you for tagging us. I'm glad you've been getting them all. And I'm pretty happy with how they came out. So first up, we've got our friend Liz Fay, wolf cub from the snowmobile trails. Totally unfamiliar with this peak. It looked pretty nice. Suspect it's, I think this was in that, um, Mononok sort of 50 finest list. So that was pretty neat. So 802 trail pup six, Oh, the dogs are back. Mike, we haven't had as many dogs since winter.

[01:19:59] I don't know what I'm going to do today. So 802 trail pup six hiking with their 74 year old dad on black mountain in Benton radar. The hound is cancer free. So didn't realize radar had cancer, but where you're glad radar, the hound is cancer free. That's exciting. We got a dog that, that be cancer on the notable hike. I know that's, I think in the original script where I put this in, I was like, I feel like you're going to pick this. I was going to put it in parentheses. Um, and then they tagged us again for Mount Cardigan.

[01:20:27] So, uh, 802 trail pup six mentioned that they've hiked Cardigan 68 times in 2025. That is insane in the membrane. Wow. Um, good for you. And this was their first round in the books for 2026. So I mean, you got to get 69 this year, right? I think we got to beat it. Either that or 67. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so we got heart disease hiker 75 cascade path in Waterville Valley. So I, this thing's beautiful. If you've never checked it out, it kind of leaves where the snow is mountain.

[01:20:58] Um, I guess bases, like there's sort of a little ski area and jumps over there. Um, and I believe they have a sled hill in the winter, um, snow permitting, but this is really beautiful. It kind of follows basically like it's probably like 33 or four bigger cascades, um, all along the side of snows. Um, and if you're there after a snow melt, it's, it's pretty spectacular. It's, I call it like a good bank for your book hike. And you also can like loop it with snows coming down the ski slopes and see to come some stuff. Um, it's really pretty. So glad you're getting out there.

[01:21:26] Heart disease hiker, our friend, Cindy, Cindy chest, Cindy C has seven training hike for 48 peaks at Middlesex fells along South and middle reservoirs. I think our friend Paul Lamar has talked about this. Have you ever gotten to over to Middlesex fells, Mike? I have not. The only thing I know about Middlesex fells is that there was a, um, an owl that was attacking people in Middlesex fells. So, uh, that's crazy. I don't know much. I mean, I've driven by it many times. I just have never been in there.

[01:21:57] Okay. Well, it looked pretty nice. Murphy is my sidekick. Madison via Daniel Webster scout trail in Osgoode. I have not done either of those. So I don't know if you want to, you've done those? I have. Yeah. Uh, Daniel Webster scout in Osgoode. I've got, I've done both of those. So yeah, Daniel Webster scout is a tough one. It's a, it's a bit of a rock hop going down. It's like extended, it's like going down the airline, but like for an extended period of time.

[01:22:21] And, um, it brings you out into that, like a campground at the bottom of, um, of Madison. So yeah, it's a tough trail, tough trail with, uh, so good for them. Yeah. Especially at shoulder season conditions. I imagine it might've been a little messy. Yeah. Then we have Arlo the Beagle is back. Also did Black Mountain in Benton for 39 out of 52, which I thought, is he competing with radar? We'll never know. But it seemed interesting that they both had been out there.

[01:22:48] Then our friend, Andy X, Summit Snack Attack X, cardigan via Holt. Um, he had some sort of acronym. I believe he called it like FOFA, but like basically it was like effing around or something like that, which sounded very Andy-esque. He mentioned it was gnarly and a sketchy bushwhack to avoid sections of wet ledge and ice. The Holt trail is like a notoriously steep trail. I think like people would say like, it should be like a T25 or like it would be one of the gnarlier T25s if it was actually on the list. I think Stomp's gone up it quite a few times too. Yes.

[01:23:15] Um, but, uh, interesting and spicy way of cardigan, I guess. Um, then he had a second tag. Um, we talked about this a little bit earlier for Liberty. Um, and he found out about the unfortunate Pemi Bear situation. And that frigging hiker, he was out on Hurricane in the Adirondacks and, uh, got some fantastic views. He did the Southern approach. Um, I've been out there before and did the Northern approach actually last year around Memorial Day weekend. Hurricane is absolutely gorgeous. It's got a tower on it. It's got open ledges looking out to a bunch of the high peaks.

[01:23:44] If you're in the area, I highly recommend it. And I'm glad he had a good time up there. Sounded like he ended up picking up that just because of weather and the whites or something. Um, Dr. M. Hikes, Star King and Wombeck for 42 out of 48 and the first 4,000 footer of 2026. Congratulations. Congratulations. Then we got, uh, Marley Sue 2. Smarts for 43 out of 52 by the Lambert Ridge Trail and Ranger Trail Loop, which, uh, look pretty nice. I think Ranger Trail is supposed to have nice, or one of those has really nice views. I went up like the back kind of way.

[01:24:12] I don't know if it was, it wasn't Daniel Doan. I think I'm thinking. I went up Lambert, I think last time. Okay. But, uh, yeah, it looked nice. So people getting out there. Making her way through the 52 with the views. So Dr. M and Marley, like when you finish your 4,000 footers and your 52 with the views will get you. But I think this week it's going to go to 802 Trail Pups underscore six for Radar the Hound who has beaten cancer and has hiked Cardigan so frequently. So. Yes. Good. Good job on both accounts.

[01:24:43] Yeah. Pulling at my heartstrings as usual. And there was much rejoicing. Um, all right, Nick.

[01:25:12] So moving on to search and rescue news here. So, uh, we've got a bunch of catch up here. Uh, so I think we can just go through these quickly. So on, in March, actually March was pretty busy too. March is, I think like March and April, when I look at like the last five or six years where we've been collecting data on average, you get about maybe three to five media reports for search and rescues, um, in, in those months.

[01:25:38] And I think that March I'm looking at right here, it's got two, four, six, seven. And then we probably covered some in earlier episodes and then, yeah, April's got a lot more. So, um. Yeah. March, March was busy. I feel like one thing from our perspective, I felt like there wasn't a lot in March and February just because of how many snowmobile crash articles that were through there. Right. Yeah. But, uh, yeah, there's been a good bit. So, uh, all right, let me just pull these up and I'll do them in order here from March. We'll just blow through these pretty quick.

[01:26:07] And I think we might've touched on some of them, but, um, all right, this is everything March, Nick. We'll do this very quickly. So injured hiker on, um, March 14th. This is a 76 year old hiker from Bridgewater was hiking down Sabadee Falls trail when she slipped and injured her ankle. She was wearing proper footwear and was using micro spikes at the time. She could not place weight on her injured ankle.

[01:26:37] So a member of the group hiked out to place a call for assistance. Again, that's a terrible spot because there's no cell phone connection. So, um, but conservation officers and Conway fire and rescue responded. They used the snow machine and rescues able to reach her location. And she was driven out to the trailhead and taken to Memorial hospital in North Conway. So all's well that ends well there. This next one was Lowe's path, Nick. So this was, was this, did we already cover this?

[01:27:07] I think we did. We did. I, we mentioned it peripherally. I don't think the article had come out yet, um, on our green, uh, recap trip, but it, and I don't know if we've got too specific on it. I think Jake might've mentioned it, but we were about 99% sure that we crossed the group of hikers where unfortunately one of them had this accident. Right. Yeah. So we were like, when we were coming down, right. When we came down gray knob, like we were, we were switching out our route depending on the, the water crossings and the, and the condition.

[01:27:36] So we ended up heading back over towards log cabin. When we got to log cabin, there was two guys there and then two, two of their friends were coming up. And I think we saw in the picture of the carrier, like one of those guys was carrying his friend. So one of those four ended up getting in trouble coming down Lowe's path the next night. So we were heading down, we were, they were heading up to the camp and then, uh, they, they must've stayed overnight when they were coming back down.

[01:28:01] One of them injured himself and then they had to walk out, um, a decent distance here. So yeah, they were, I guess about a mile away from gray knob and the caretaker was able to get a litter and splinting materials out there. And then while waiting for the rescue team to ascend, they were able to slide down the snow and ice pack trail on his butt with assistance of his hiking companions. So they made it maybe a little under half a mile.

[01:28:30] And then once the rescue is, Nick, I don't know how the hell they carried anybody down that, that, that trail. No, that's what I was thinking when I was reading that. I mean, and they say pack, pack snow and ice is being kind. And it was mostly like boiler plate ice for like extended sections, especially on low path. Um, there was one section where we'd like straight up bushwhacked and not like hardcore, like we could see the trail, but like we went completely around section of trail because it was just like, we're like, we're not getting down this safely. It's impossible. Right. The ice flows that weekend were insane.

[01:29:00] So, um, hats off to the rescuers, hats off to that crew of guys. They would definitely experience, like they had all the gear, they were heading up to the camp. They have sleeping bags and everything. So they were ready to stay out if they needed to, but even to get like almost a half a mile down just on your butt and shout out to Declan, the caretaker too. Yeah. And Declan for, uh, for helping out there. I'm sure that it was a long, long day for him. Yeah. Um, yeah, we were just saying, Jay, it's kind of one of those. It could have easily, it was a little bit a humbling.

[01:29:29] Cause I'm like, that could have easily happened to any of us that day. Like we, I think all of us sort of, we were all falling on the way out. Like even when it was flat, cause it was just like, it, I don't know. It was just a mess that day. Right. Right. It was tough conditions. Right. And then this next one, this was on Thursday, March 19th. So two guys from, um, where were they from? Rhode Island. So this was two Rhode Islanders. So we see this a lot with the flume slide. So they were, I think they went up Liberty Springs and then they were doing an overnight

[01:29:57] camp out and then, uh, they were heading down flume. And I think they decided to go down flume slide, which is a mistake. I think in those icy conditions. So this was right around this time that we were dealing with lows, the, the ice flows must've been insane on the flume slide. I can only imagine. So, uh, the two hikers, they had been out already overnight. Um, around two 15, they called fishing game. And they basically said that they were stuck near the top of the flume slide trail in Lincoln.

[01:30:26] And they explained that the trail was too icy. They weren't able to ascend or descend. So basically they were kind of stuck in their location. I think one of them fell. Uh, I read that somewhere, but it was basically determined the only way to get the hikers down was to send rescuers with crampons, ropes, and harnesses. So mountain rescue service in Pammy Valley search and rescue responded to the trailhead and the hiker, they rescued, the rescue was hiked up to the stranded hikers, got there around six 15.

[01:30:52] They had ropes, crampons, harnesses, and they were able to lower the hikers to safety. So once they got them to a safe area, they could all hike out. Didn't get out till like 11 o'clock. So 30 year old hikers, they only had micro spikes, no crampons, and they had spent the night out camping. And, you know, this was a big, big thing. The rescuers had to set up safety lines because of the brook crossings were dangerous. So it was just not a good time to be out in the flume area.

[01:31:19] So, no, and I'd argue it was just a bad time to be out on almost anything. The way the trails looked kind of that, that week and a half or I don't know if it was like a two week stretch kind of. Yeah. And I wasn't even thinking about the fact that there's some pretty good river crossings on the way down the way things were flowing that weekend. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's the one I fell in, me and Stomp, when we did that minus 25 degree day, I fell in the river. Yeah. Yeah. Ooh. And that was like, we were expecting it to be frozen over and it wasn't frozen over. It just runs really fast.

[01:31:49] Yeah. So it never gets like ice bridge. Wow. Wow. That's tough. Yeah. And then three days later on March 22nd, there was a rescue in Monadnock. Pretty straightforward. This was a Massachusetts hiker, 26 year old, hiking with his friends when he slipped and fell on the Dublin trail. And Upper Valley Wilderness Response Team got up the trail with equipment. He was about two miles up.

[01:32:15] So they had to get him down rough terrain and back to the trail. So the call came in at 4.15. He was out by eight o'clock. So they were experienced hikers. They were just doing like a one day trip up to the summit and back. And they just had a little slip there. So. Yep. And then the last one is a 23 year old hiker from Missouri was on Mount Major with his wife

[01:32:44] and they started hiking around 4.30. It was a little late for March 27th, Nick. It is. He slipped on some ice and fell, hurt his shoulder. They couldn't continue hiking. So the wife called 9-1-1 and then Lakes Region got up there. Fishing game got up there and they were able to get a UTV up to him and transport him out the remainder of the way. So yeah. Slippery on Mount Major, Nick.

[01:33:15] Yeah. Yeah. I will say though, 4.30, it's not really the longest hike just to get to the top of Major. If you're going for sunset or something. I guess. But it is a little late in the day. I'd say if he's from Missouri, maybe he doesn't know the area that well. That's fair. Probably a fair assumption. Right. And then this last one. So the injured hiker assisted up Gap Mountain in Troy. I don't know anything about that. What's Gap Mountain, Nick? No, I was actually kind of looking.

[01:33:42] I believe it's out in the western kind of portion of the state. I looked up this before. Yeah. It's out in the Monodnock regions. It's just southwest of Mount Monodnock. So that kind of keen area and whatnot. Got it. Yeah. So this was a 42-year- It was Fitzwilliam almost. Yeah. This guy's from Ringe, New Hampshire, which I think is out there. So two hikers, they were summiting Gap Mountain, hiking back down, slipped on wet rocks, and suffered a serious but non-life-threatening injury to his leg.

[01:34:10] The hiker's partner called 911. They were able to get GPS coordinates from the 911, which placed him close to the north summit of Gap Mountain. And then a bunch of local fire departments and the conservation officers responded, and they were able to hike in, and they were able to also get UTV out to him to drive him back down. So call came in at 345, and he was able to get out around six o'clock.

[01:34:40] He didn't want an ambulance transport, and I guess he just decided to go on his own to get medical assistance. Yeah. I got to get it. I always say this, but it sounds like there's a lot of nice mountains out in the Monadnock region, but it's almost longer for me to get there, almost the same as the white, so I just don't think about it usually. Yeah. Yeah. I like, we'll have to do, we need to do a Friday night hike to Monadnock. It's a good time. That sounds cool. Yeah.

[01:35:09] And then this next one, we got two more, we got one that just came out, Nick, but we'll do this one first. So this is Iron Mountain. Matter of fact, our friend Jay, he had just messaged that the gates opened up in Iron Mountain and- Ooh. Isn't that road supposed to be like ridiculous? That's what I've heard. I've heard it's a bouncy road, so, but I have a, well, I have a nice clearance on my vehicle, Nick, so I think I should be okay. Yes. I'll have to steal my air out back if I ever get there. Right. I'm not taking my car down that thing. Yeah, definitely not the blue car.

[01:35:39] So, yeah. So this was a 60-year-old from Rhode Island, accompanied by his wife, so they reached the summit of Iron Mountain, and this gentleman climbed up the fire tower to a platform and fell due to a loose board. I didn't know that they had a fire tower on Iron Mountain. I didn't know that either. I thought that it's like, isn't it like a ledge overlook kind of deal? That's what I thought. I've never been on it.

[01:36:09] It's a different Iron Mountain? I don't know. It wasn't on the 52 with a view list when I did the 52 with a view, so it's one of those ones I got to get out to. Yeah, same here. I haven't done, I've driven past it and like noticed where it is. Yeah. Huh. All right. So I guess he climbed a fire tower and fractured his ankle. Yeah, or it's a typo and it was like Cursage North or something like that. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. That is odd. But Fishing Game responded. So the call came in around 11 a.m.

[01:36:37] Fishing Game responded along with Lakes Region Search and Rescue and Andrew Scoggin Valley Search and Rescue. And they got to him around 1.45 and assessed and stabilized him, put him in a litter, and he was carried down the trail and was driven to Memorial Hospital in North Conway around 3.45. So yeah, long day for them. So I guess just be careful. I guess I didn't know that Iron Mountain has a fire tower. And neither did I.

[01:37:04] And then last but not least, Nick, this just came out as you were talking during the show. I was perusing the internet and I saw that two unprepared hikers were rescued on Mount Liberty. Oh, yesterday, huh? Yeah, yeah. So this is not good. So the hikers identified as two ladies from Quebec, Canada. The pier had summited Mount Liberty and had started to hike across Franconia Ridge when

[01:37:31] fading light and existing knee-deep snow made them disoriented. So yeah, that section between Liberty and Little Haystack is a bit of a no man's land out there. I don't think anybody goes through there yet. Yeah, no. I remember Paul Gamela and I back in, gosh, it was probably December, we crossed someone that was going up Flumin across the ridge and they were asking us.

[01:37:58] We saw him at the junction of Franconia Ridge Trail in Liberty Springs. They're like, oh, how do you think it is out there? And I'm like, I feel like nobody's probably been out there. Um, you will be breaking trail from there to Little Haystack almost certainly. And snow, it's all back in the woods there too. So like snow is going to accumulate pretty well over there and it's pretty wide ridge. It's not like it's spiny over there. So it must, uh, hold snow. Well, even evidently from these two, uh, two folks up there, it holds snow pretty well. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:38:24] I wondered there was somebody that was asking about that section on social media last week. Like they had even posted a map and circled it and said like, what, what goes on in here in this area between Liberty and it's a little haystack. It's flat. And then it goes like a thousand feet up to Little Haystack. There'd be diamonds in there. Um, I don't know, maybe it was that, but anyways, two hikers from Canada. So they had summited Mount Liberty and started a hike across Franconia Ridge and then the lights started fading and then they had knee deep snow, which made them disoriented.

[01:38:55] The, they felt lost and they placed a phone call for help. So the pair was utilizing the all trails app to navigate and advised them that this led to, this apparently led to a lot of their confusion. So a conservation officer was able to convince them to turn around and head back down towards the Liberty Spring Trail instead of continuing north along the ridge towards Little Haystack. After speaking with them, um, a pair of conservation officers began a response up to Liberty Springs Trail with equipment.

[01:39:22] The rescuers reached the pier at 1115 and provided gear to them. Rescuers assisted the two hikers down the 2.2 miles of steep ice, steep ice trail and everybody exited by 2.22 AM without any injuries. So that's it. I guess there's no caretaker at Liberty Springs at this time of the year? The campsite? Yeah, maybe not. I, I thought they had one all the time, but maybe not. I think so. I wonder how far they made it up past that junction. I don't know.

[01:39:51] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And also, also I always say, again, like you can use all like in all harp on, I don't want to sound hypocro. I use all trails for planning and stuff, but you, you do need to look at kind of the routes and stuff. Cause that app is, it just like stuff that stuff is labeled in there. Like that doesn't like exist. Like it'll say loops of things that aren't a thing or incorrect. So you do have to pay attention. And I use the offline maps too. Usually the GPS is pretty good, but I've had it wig out on me many times.

[01:40:18] If you really want something for navigating when you don't know where you're on trail and I'll shout out to like our Garmin watches, like when we were in Jefferson and basically a whiteout, like those things, GPS type watches and things like that from Garmin are probably going to be a lot more reliable than all trails. Yeah. If you are in a situation like that. Yeah. And it's like that section from the junction over is sneaky, kind of sneaky long distance. You're talking two miles.

[01:40:49] Yeah. And then it kind of goes up like a, not really a cliff, but it's, it's a good steep up to get up to a little haystack too. When it starts climbing there, you're kind of got a couple of little exposed spots where you have some nice, some really, really great views back out to Flumin Liberty. Right. Um, but there's like a little step ladder in one spot and. Right. Cause you're up over. You got some spots where you're scrambling a little bit. You're up over 4,000 feet when you get to that ridge and then you drop back down below

[01:41:13] 4,000 and then it's actually a sneaky steep climb to get to the shelf before haystack. And then you've got that last push up to haystack, which is a good distance. So. Yeah, it's funny. I never had done that until this year and I ended up doing it twice going over from Liberty up there. And, uh, it's, it's interesting. Like, it's funny on a map. Like I was looking at it client. It's almost like the contour lines in that too. It doesn't show how aggressively it goes up. Like you get it.

[01:41:41] There's one point where you can kind of see the face of haystack, little haystack sticking up. And it's a really cool perspective cause you don't have that perspective from anywhere else. Um, you can't see it from the highway or from looking over and you're kind of glaring up at, you're like, Oh, like little haystack is its own mountain. Cause it kind of tends to, you look at it from far away. It kind of just looks like it's part of the ridge and you see like just bumps along the ridge line, but it's, it's a steep up from that little coal in between Liberty. Yeah. There is a little chimney too, which I don't know what that's like in winter, but it's not, it's, I can't imagine it's that easy. Probably not great.

[01:42:11] It's not as bad as Bond Cliff, but it's, it's a, it's a coal. So anyway, everybody is safe at this point. Um, so. No, that's good. I guess we're all good to go. And I think with that, Nick, we're going to go. Yeah. We're all, we're all caught up. That was a solid episode. I didn't get to my history, but we'll, we'll do that next time. Okay. All right. We'll pocket it. It was a good, it was a good house cleaning episode. It was. Okay. I feel complete. We'll see, we'll see you next week, people. All right. Bye everybody.

[01:42:43] Thank you for listening. If you enjoyed the show, you can subscribe on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Podbean, YouTube, or wherever you listen to podcasts. If you want to learn more about the topics covered in today's show, please check out the show notes and safety information at slasherpodcast.com. That's S L A S R podcast.com. You can also follow the show on Facebook and Instagram.

[01:43:13] We hope you'll join us next week for another great show until then on behalf of Mike and Stomp, get out there and crush some mega peaks. Now covered in scratches, blisters, and bug bites. Chris staff wanted to complete his most challenging day hike ever. Fish and game officers say the hiker from Florida activated an emergency beacon yesterday morning. He was hiking along the Appalachian trail when the weather started to get worse.

[01:43:43] Officials say the snow was piled up to three feet in some spots and there was a wind chill of minus one degree. And there's three words to describe this race. Do we all know who they are? Oh, yeah. Lieutenant James Neeland from New Hampshire Fish and Game. Lieutenant, thanks for being with us today. Thanks for having me. What are some of the most common mistakes you see people make when they're heading out on the trails to hike here in New Hampshire? Seems to me the most common is being unprepared.

[01:44:09] I think if they just simply visited hikesafe.com and got a list of the 10 essential items and had those in their packs, they probably would have no need to ever call us at all.